-Kamelion
Lol. Somewhere on the boards, I’ve found comments credited to Lynn Abey regarding the writing of her books and state of affairs during her time on TSR. She mentions a rumor (though some might say nightmare) about space haflings, which I quote:
I was told that the halflings were coming back in planet-killer space ships to do war with the Dragon-kings and recreate the Blue era. I thought that had zero potential for the sort of stories I like to write.
- Lynn Abey
And I think that had zero potential for the sort of stories I like to game with. Buuut… You see, before Dark Sun, Troy Denning did some jobs for West End Games, which at the time held the license for the Star Wars RPG. One of the jobs was a source book (Galaxy Guide4) on several of the strange aliens that appeared throughout the cantina scene in the first movie. That work had, and still has, some small but relevant influence on all the SW fiction published ever since, from novels to the movies themselves. Years later he was invited, among several other competent writers like R. A. Salvatore, to conceive and write a huge new series they named New Jedi Order. The series plot goes like this:
Some 25 years after the battle of Yavin (Episode IV), bloodthirsty aliens called Yuuzhan Vong invade the Galaxy on planet-killing ships to do war with the New Republic (what the Rebel Alliance became after EPVI). The use of mechanical technology is anathema to these aliens. To them, the only “clean” tools, vehicles and weapons are those made of living creatures, and the scientist/priests that manufacture these are called shapers… Also, the Vong seem unable to use the force, or be affected by it. That makes the jobs of Luke Skywalker and the hundred-odd Jedi he has trained so far that much harder.
I apologize if this has come up before and hope you guys find it as interesting as I have.
Lurking Shadow
Like many others, I dont believe in the theory of a Planet-killer-halfling ship just waiting for the right moment to attack. I'm not saying their not halflings-just not planet destroyers-. I meen think about it; if it is realy a ship of any kind native of Athas, only the Rhulisti may had had the knowledge to "grow" one ( or many) but the Rhulisti race were nature adorater. Even the evil life-benders (do not confound with Life-shapers) were trying to bend nature in ways it was never ment but were not destroyers of the world.
This said, maybe a group of Rhulisti wondered if there was other planets around the sun.(back when the Brown tide was "killing" the water) Maybe they found one among the stars surrounding Athas but when one of the ship came back, something went wrong and now all it can do is orbit around Athas.
Then again, like I said previously I realy doubt this could ever be considered official but even less a halfling space-ship ment to invade Athas.
-- Now dont worry: The thought of incorporating any information of the above post in the story I'm writing on the Rhul-Thaun race has not cross my mind a bit. ( I have other more interesting surprises for the past.)
that sound like a Spell Jammer thing, and the spacefarer's handbook says Athas the wourld of DS is not on any known spacelanes, so its ether just unreachable or to far from the known spheres that it would take life times to get any where. also the defiling power of a spelljammer would certanly wreak havoc on the fragile balance of life. But if a mage from say Krinn who knows nothing of defiling might have no affect on the planet but who can say?
but to the point, say the haflings left Athas and its sphere travel the phlogiston for generations and then get bored then they say lets go home so they turn around head home then they see athas for what it is and see what it has become and say well lets punish the people for what they have done blah blah blah... interesting plot but kinda messed up.
Originally posted by Zotar! the 6932th!
[B...But if a mage from say Krinn who knows nothing of defiling might have no affect on the planet but who can say?[/b]
If you remembert, 2nd Ed. Dragonlance Wizards couldn't use their magic when they left Krynn. They are too tied to the gods of magic and the three moons. It's also the reason that when the 5th Age Dragonlance was released, that the orders of high sorcery were inert and useless, which is why Palin, with the Shadow Sorcerer and The Master discovered sorcery. If I recall, Strahd von Zarovitch of Ravenloft actually had a red robe Krynnish wizard stuck in a dungeon, who was relatively useless (couldn't cast spells) but was able to use magical items that Strahd himself couldn't figure out. Of course he also had the wizard's tongue removed and blinded him...
...but I digress...
Originally posted by True_Blue
This is more Dragonlance, than Dark Sun, but I never did like it when people said that Krynn magic users were tied too closely to the Gods of Magic. If that were true, than the magic users wouldn't be able to visit other planes.
From a 2e standpoint, wizards from Krynn lost any benefits of moon magic (i.e. high sanction) when they left Krynn. Otherwise, they acted like a normal wizard.
After Dragons of Summer Flame, all wizards on Krynn lost their magic. This was what really tied all wizard magic to the moons.
The 2e cosmology, where nearly all worlds were tied together, really does not do well to represent each individual world. The mechanics of Dragonlance magic, Forgotten Realms magic, and Dark Sun magic are all different. When you mix and match them, then you have to figure out how everything works together.
Don't get me wrong, I'm a big fan of Spelljammer and I enjoyed the universal cosmology back in the day. I just think that not all worlds should be connected.
If that's the case then it seems odd that 2nd ed encouraged such cross-cosmological campaign events whereas 3rd ed discourages it while holding a principle of rule consistency across settings. Seems contradictory if I've understood it right.
Anyway, back to discussing how Krynn Moon Mages have sorcerous dogfights with Halfling Space Invaders....
I know some worlds have their own cosmotology, so this isn't the exact way it is done. Like Dragonlance has its own Abyss.
I think I would just rule that whatever world you are on, is the way the magic works. Just like whatever plane you are on, effects how magic works, gravity, etc.
I dunno, for some odd reason, I've found it odd in 3e to think that so many worlds are similar, yet they arent related or have ways of getting to them from others.
Originally posted by True_Blue
I know some worlds have their own cosmotology, so this isn't the exact way it is done. Like Dragonlance has its own Abyss.
Not really. They just much the Abyss and Baator together.
Originally posted by Cole Deschain
Not really. They just much the Abyss and Baator together.
Dragonlance does, in fact, have it's own Abyss, which is nothing like the standard Abyss in the Manual of the Planes. The cosmology of prior editions that tried to tie each setting together really did not work well with Dragonlance.
On another note...
Isn't it a 3rd Ed D&D principle that there be complete consistency across game worlds and campaign settings so that for any element of the system, particularly magic, then (to quote from www.athas.org) "You ought to be able to use the system on worlds other than Athas."
Third edition has set up a universal game system for use in each campaign world, which only needs some tweaks here and there for each world's own individual mechanics.
However, each world now has it's own cosmology. This was a blessing for settings such as Dragonlance, yet not so good for settings such as Spelljammer and Planescape.
Originally posted by Dragonhelm
Dragonlance does, in fact, have it's own Abyss, which is nothing like the standard Abyss in the Manual of the Planes. The cosmology of prior editions that tried to tie each setting together really did not work well with Dragonlance.
No, they just got the Nine Hells and the Abyss mixed up. At least, that's how it was in 2E- considering that Abishai were ALWAYS the spirits used in making Draconians.
And yes, I;m aware that some of the early Dragonlance adventures featred an "Abyss" that was kinda funky.
But think.
Don;t those settings remind you of the Astral plane?
Originally posted by Cole Deschain
No, they just got the Nine Hells and the Abyss mixed up. At least, that's how it was in 2E- considering that Abishai were ALWAYS the spirits used in making Draconians.
Right, but not the way it was presented in novels, nor was it the way it was presented in Dragonlance Adventures in 1e, IIRC.
However, as xlorepdarkhelm mentioned, that's all really just water under the bridge at this point. Each setting now has it's own cosmology. If you want to use a more 2e-ish cosmology, go for it.
just a reminder :D
Each setting now has it's own cosmology. If you want to use a more 2e-ish cosmology, go for it.
Which is one of the reason that I use a closed metaverse for Dark Sun. In this way, one can develope the type of planes and universe for Athas that it was meant to have without the worry of 'how does this retro fit into the old planescape and spelljammer settings'.
But enough of theories. The killer halflings from outer space (KHFOS) are comming. They ride their mighty space hamsters to battle. They weild death dealing laser pen pistols. The messenger is the mothership. All will fall before their onslaught of cheese. There will be no assimilation . . .