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Planescape questions

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
zombiegleemax
Nov 14, 2003 9:15:52 I am new to this board so bear with me.

1. Has any 'official' planescape material been released?(if not, then
when?)

2. Why would FR get cut out of the loop?

3. Does the 'offical' PS website have problems, or is it just me?

4. Other than that website what other sources of information is there
for 3.0 compatable PS?
#2
incenjucar
Nov 14, 2003 9:24:45 Welcome.

Planewalker is as close to official as it gets in 3e.

All settings have been cut out of the loop; someone at WotC has issues.

The website is rarely updated.
Aside from the content update, the only change to it recently that I'm aware of is me nagging them in to changing the text color until it stopped hurting my eyes. :D

MotP, BoVD, and BoED have a lot of planar material; some of it truer than others.
#3
zombiegleemax
Nov 14, 2003 10:23:50 What Incenjucar said. Planes and Portals is out too, and it looks as dodgy as all hell from what I've seen.

Oh, and... unless you want to start a forum equivalent of the Blood War, don't mention 'FR' too loudly.
#4
Shemeska_the_Marauder
Nov 14, 2003 11:46:31 I've already been in some of those Blood War equivalents over on the FR boards already. But they're so fun in their ignorance!

*holds hands together happily and smiles that toothy Arcanaloth grin*

The website over at Planewalker is updated slowly because A) people are still writing the material, B) art is still being done and we're still looking for more artists, C) editing is a pain in the rear.

We're trying to stick to a schedule of when we'll be releasing stuff, but its difficult. The next up for release is the Guide to Sigil, and as of today I'm finally starting the draft revisions on it. Once those are done, it'll do back for more desecration by red ink, then I pitch a hissy fit till I get my way on parts of it, rinse and repeat. :D
#5
zombiegleemax
Nov 14, 2003 11:53:12 Heh, so no offical reasoning as to why FR is cut out of the loop?

Is this matieral that is being edited going to be released by WoTC, or will it be downloadable expansion type stuff?

I always really dug the PS setting, as it seemed a good way to allow for some wide open campaigns, allowing DM's to draw from the every source out there. Would love to see it return for 3e.....
#6
Shemeska_the_Marauder
Nov 14, 2003 12:04:41 Everything on Planewalker is considered "official" however we can't make money off of it. So anything we write and design will be released as a free download. And well, free is probably everyone's favorite word(s) in the English language. (next to default and mathematically impossible)

As for why FR was supposedly broken off into its own thing. I don't know, but it was a mistake in my opinion. They've had a horror of a time trying to explain away the horde of contradictions with all of their previously printing material from 2e and before. For what it matters I don't know a single DM running an FR game who actually uses the new FR cosmology. Every one of them still uses the Great Wheel / Planescape cosmology for the realms. *shrugs*

I still like the realms mind you, it has its good points. But it tests my patience with anything planar lately.
#7
kuje31
Nov 14, 2003 13:10:54
Originally posted by Shemeska the Marauder
Everything on Planewalker is considered "official" however we can't make money off of it. So anything we write and design will be released as a free download. And well, free is probably everyone's favorite word(s) in the English language. (next to default and mathematically impossible)

As for why FR was supposedly broken off into its own thing. I don't know, but it was a mistake in my opinion. They've had a horror of a time trying to explain away the horde of contradictions with all of their previously printing material from 2e and before. For what it matters I don't know a single DM running an FR game who actually uses the new FR cosmology. Every one of them still uses the Great Wheel / Planescape cosmology for the realms. *shrugs*

I still like the realms mind you, it has its good points. But it tests my patience with anything planar lately.

Hey hey, not all of us FR fan(atics) are ignorant! But you are right, and bah for the "new" planes for FR. They can burn in the Hells forever as far as I am concerned. It opens up way to many errors in FR if you do not to use the Great Ring/Wheel.

And really if WOTC is going to stick with the "new" planes then they really need to stop putting portals to Sigil or Pandemonium (sp?) (this portal is in the new Underdark sourcebook) in the new sourcebooks. Yes I know they are errors but it's a great way to confuse the heck out of some one.
#8
incenjucar
Nov 14, 2003 13:26:11 I think its safe to say that a good number of the WotC staff thinks the staff that decided to screw with the Planescape-type info were on something, just like we do, and ignore their foolishness, just like we do.
#9
zombiegleemax
Nov 14, 2003 22:55:04 What's the policy on the art for PS3E?
#10
moogle001
Nov 15, 2003 3:33:53 Back in the early days of 3.0 Wizards came to the conclusion that TSR went out of business partially because it diversified itself so much with campaign settings. Since each campaign setting was a niche group in and of itself, it could not attract sales on the level of core/general material. Thus Wizards decided to get rid of them all, save for Forgotten Realms (though they were considering that too). The cosmology was changed because since neither Planescape, the 2E multiverse, nor multiple interacting campaigns existed anymore. Since having a campaign setting be seperate from everything else makes it easier for them to ignore any contradictions, they put together that poor substitute of a cosmology. Of course WotC doesn't have a good track record for contradictions in its own material anyways.
#11
zombiegleemax
Nov 15, 2003 5:36:59 Here's the cynical take on the above...

Back in the early days of 3.0, Wizards decided that TSR collapsed because it made the mistake of trying to deliver what people liked instead of telling them what they want.

The whole thing reminds me of 1984. I'm sure that WotC's development folks have 4 little ministries -
the Ministry of Roleplay, which encourages Hack'n'Slash.
the Ministry of Individuality, which forces conformity.
the Ministry of Flavour, which develops rules.
the Ministry of Continuity, which prints contradictions.

Reforming the cosmology was a delicate move, which on the surface might look like a response to their limited support for settings. It instead seems like they want to remove the need to think, enticing the ff/dbz/whatever player into buying poor-quality materials based around acquiring huge bonuses to hack things to tiny bits.
#12
zombiegleemax
Nov 15, 2003 10:45:06 I'm happy noone cares that they changed the Dragonlance cosmology. I like the new one. I could never buy that the Krynn-lings just thought that Takhisis lived in a place called "the Abyss" and not Baator. It didn't gel right at all. By seperating it out into a different multiverse altogether it ties in all of that. Sure, there are a few snags (There was a book were Tas summoned Demogorgon into the world) but overall it works out well.

Plus, DL isn't owned by WotC so adding the Great Wheel would be copyright infringement anyways.
#13
alien_rope_burn
Nov 15, 2003 10:58:52
Originally posted by Shemeska the Marauder
I still like the realms mind you, it has its good points. But it tests my patience with anything planar lately.

I'm sure the FR planar cosmology would be more viable if it was actually detailed. AFAIK, all we have is a list of names of planes, and no detail at all. They might as well be PS realms for all it matters, really.

Sadly, it feels like they included the Shadow Plane as a transitive plane because that's the way it was in FR, even though FR's been cut out of the loop... it hurts my head.
#14
kuje31
Nov 15, 2003 12:19:55
Originally posted by Alien Rope Burn
I'm sure the FR planar cosmology would be more viable if it was actually detailed. AFAIK, all we have is a list of names of planes, and no detail at all. They might as well be PS realms for all it matters, really.

Sadly, it feels like they included the Shadow Plane as a transitive plane because that's the way it was in FR, even though FR's been cut out of the loop... it hurts my head.

Well it's supposed to be detailed in the upcoming Players Guide to FR, but that doesn't come out till March.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 zombiegleemax Nov 14, 2003 9:15:52	I am new to this board so bear with me. 1. Has any 'official' planescape material been released?(if not, then when?) 2. Why would FR get cut out of the loop? 3. Does the 'offical' PS website have problems, or is it just me? 4. Other than that website what other sources of information is there for 3.0 compatable PS?
#2 incenjucar Nov 14, 2003 9:24:45	Welcome. Planewalker is as close to official as it gets in 3e. All settings have been cut out of the loop; someone at WotC has issues. The website is rarely updated. Aside from the content update, the only change to it recently that I'm aware of is me nagging them in to changing the text color until it stopped hurting my eyes. :D MotP, BoVD, and BoED have a lot of planar material; some of it truer than others.
#3 zombiegleemax Nov 14, 2003 10:23:50	What Incenjucar said. Planes and Portals is out too, and it looks as dodgy as all hell from what I've seen. Oh, and... unless you want to start a forum equivalent of the Blood War, don't mention 'FR' too loudly.
#4 Shemeska_the_Marauder Nov 14, 2003 11:46:31	I've already been in some of those Blood War equivalents over on the FR boards already. But they're so fun in their ignorance! holds hands together happily and smiles that toothy Arcanaloth grin The website over at Planewalker is updated slowly because A) people are still writing the material, B) art is still being done and we're still looking for more artists, C) editing is a pain in the rear. We're trying to stick to a schedule of when we'll be releasing stuff, but its difficult. The next up for release is the Guide to Sigil, and as of today I'm finally starting the draft revisions on it. Once those are done, it'll do back for more desecration by red ink, then I pitch a hissy fit till I get my way on parts of it, rinse and repeat. :D
#5 zombiegleemax Nov 14, 2003 11:53:12	Heh, so no offical reasoning as to why FR is cut out of the loop? Is this matieral that is being edited going to be released by WoTC, or will it be downloadable expansion type stuff? I always really dug the PS setting, as it seemed a good way to allow for some wide open campaigns, allowing DM's to draw from the every source out there. Would love to see it return for 3e.....
#6 Shemeska_the_Marauder Nov 14, 2003 12:04:41	Everything on Planewalker is considered "official" however we can't make money off of it. So anything we write and design will be released as a free download. And well, free is probably everyone's favorite word(s) in the English language. (next to default and mathematically impossible) As for why FR was supposedly broken off into its own thing. I don't know, but it was a mistake in my opinion. They've had a horror of a time trying to explain away the horde of contradictions with all of their previously printing material from 2e and before. For what it matters I don't know a single DM running an FR game who actually uses the new FR cosmology. Every one of them still uses the Great Wheel / Planescape cosmology for the realms. shrugs I still like the realms mind you, it has its good points. But it tests my patience with anything planar lately.
#7 kuje31 Nov 14, 2003 13:10:54	Originally posted by Shemeska the Marauder Everything on Planewalker is considered "official" however we can't make money off of it. So anything we write and design will be released as a free download. And well, free is probably everyone's favorite word(s) in the English language. (next to default and mathematically impossible) As for why FR was supposedly broken off into its own thing. I don't know, but it was a mistake in my opinion. They've had a horror of a time trying to explain away the horde of contradictions with all of their previously printing material from 2e and before. For what it matters I don't know a single DM running an FR game who actually uses the new FR cosmology. Every one of them still uses the Great Wheel / Planescape cosmology for the realms. shrugs I still like the realms mind you, it has its good points. But it tests my patience with anything planar lately. Hey hey, not all of us FR fan(atics) are ignorant! But you are right, and bah for the "new" planes for FR. They can burn in the Hells forever as far as I am concerned. It opens up way to many errors in FR if you do not to use the Great Ring/Wheel. And really if WOTC is going to stick with the "new" planes then they really need to stop putting portals to Sigil or Pandemonium (sp?) (this portal is in the new Underdark sourcebook) in the new sourcebooks. Yes I know they are errors but it's a great way to confuse the heck out of some one.
#8 incenjucar Nov 14, 2003 13:26:11	I think its safe to say that a good number of the WotC staff thinks the staff that decided to screw with the Planescape-type info were on something, just like we do, and ignore their foolishness, just like we do.
#9 zombiegleemax Nov 14, 2003 22:55:04	What's the policy on the art for PS3E?
#10 moogle001 Nov 15, 2003 3:33:53	Back in the early days of 3.0 Wizards came to the conclusion that TSR went out of business partially because it diversified itself so much with campaign settings. Since each campaign setting was a niche group in and of itself, it could not attract sales on the level of core/general material. Thus Wizards decided to get rid of them all, save for Forgotten Realms (though they were considering that too). The cosmology was changed because since neither Planescape, the 2E multiverse, nor multiple interacting campaigns existed anymore. Since having a campaign setting be seperate from everything else makes it easier for them to ignore any contradictions, they put together that poor substitute of a cosmology. Of course WotC doesn't have a good track record for contradictions in its own material anyways.
#11 zombiegleemax Nov 15, 2003 5:36:59	Here's the cynical take on the above... Back in the early days of 3.0, Wizards decided that TSR collapsed because it made the mistake of trying to deliver what people liked instead of telling them what they want. The whole thing reminds me of 1984. I'm sure that WotC's development folks have 4 little ministries - the Ministry of Roleplay, which encourages Hack'n'Slash. the Ministry of Individuality, which forces conformity. the Ministry of Flavour, which develops rules. the Ministry of Continuity, which prints contradictions. Reforming the cosmology was a delicate move, which on the surface might look like a response to their limited support for settings. It instead seems like they want to remove the need to think, enticing the ff/dbz/whatever player into buying poor-quality materials based around acquiring huge bonuses to hack things to tiny bits.
#12 zombiegleemax Nov 15, 2003 10:45:06	I'm happy noone cares that they changed the Dragonlance cosmology. I like the new one. I could never buy that the Krynn-lings just thought that Takhisis lived in a place called "the Abyss" and not Baator. It didn't gel right at all. By seperating it out into a different multiverse altogether it ties in all of that. Sure, there are a few snags (There was a book were Tas summoned Demogorgon into the world) but overall it works out well. Plus, DL isn't owned by WotC so adding the Great Wheel would be copyright infringement anyways.
#13 alien_rope_burn Nov 15, 2003 10:58:52	Originally posted by Shemeska the Marauder I still like the realms mind you, it has its good points. But it tests my patience with anything planar lately. I'm sure the FR planar cosmology would be more viable if it was actually detailed. AFAIK, all we have is a list of names of planes, and no detail at all. They might as well be PS realms for all it matters, really. Sadly, it feels like they included the Shadow Plane as a transitive plane because that's the way it was in FR, even though FR's been cut out of the loop... it hurts my head.
#14 kuje31 Nov 15, 2003 12:19:55	Originally posted by Alien Rope Burn I'm sure the FR planar cosmology would be more viable if it was actually detailed. AFAIK, all we have is a list of names of planes, and no detail at all. They might as well be PS realms for all it matters, really. Sadly, it feels like they included the Shadow Plane as a transitive plane because that's the way it was in FR, even though FR's been cut out of the loop... it hurts my head. Well it's supposed to be detailed in the upcoming Players Guide to FR, but that doesn't come out till March.