Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 Dragonhelm Dec 23, 2003 23:17:22	Hey, gang! I'm working on the Legend of Huma comic adaptation, and as I'm looking ahead, I've got a bit of a dilemma. On pages 271-272, the heroes face off against the warlord Crynus. The silver dragon breathes fire on Crynus, and he goes out in a burst of flame. The silver dragon explains that all dragons, save whites, can do this. Obviously, this is one of those errors in continuity that snuck in, as silver dragons breathe a cone of cold. I want to fix this for the comic adaptation, so I thought I would get some input from you guys. The first possible solution is that the silver dragon casts a fire spell, rather than using her breath weapon. The upside is that it fits the story, and maintains continuity. The downside is that a spell isn't as taxing as a breath weapon, and it isn't as cool of a visual. Option two that I have is that the silver dragon breathes a cone of cold on Crynus, he turns to ice, then explodes - sending ice shards everywhere. What do you guys think of these options, and do you have any other ideas on how to handle this?
#2 The_White_Sorcerer Dec 23, 2003 23:40:03	Originally posted by Dragonhelm Option two that I have is that the silver dragon breathes a cone of cold on Crynus, he turns to ice, then explodes - sending ice shards everywhere. I was gonna suggest this myself, but you came up with it yourself. So I vote for this.
#3 talinthas Dec 23, 2003 23:41:13	you know, this issue of all dragons breathing fire happened a few times in early DL, namely in LoH and Darkness and Light (remember cupelix?). Honestly, i'd rather you followed the standards and had the silver breath ice, than deal with the canon bombs that will drop if you stick to a true translation of LoH. We can just chalk it up to there not being enough DL source material at the time. Kinda like the KoS being so huge and influential that early on, even though solamnia would have still been very young. Remember the huma in Anvil of Time? Thats what tracy intended for the chara- a legend, adopted by the KoS. Obviously, LoH doesnt deal with that. While people moan about retcons, in this case, i think that retroactively changing the story to fit what is a standard of DL is the right option.
#4 ferratus Dec 24, 2003 2:45:21	There are two ways to solve this really. One is to simply have her have an extra speech bubble with magic runes in it before she breathes fire. Then the reader (if she recognizes that white dragons breathe ice) will think that the dragon cast a spell to change her breath weapon. Otherwise just have the dragon breathe ice and kill the guy that way. Dead is dead. ;) He can just shatter when Huma hits him with his sword. Less plausible as a final death though, given that Crynus was putting his body parts back together when they were hacked off.
#5 ferratus Dec 24, 2003 2:46:34	Oops. Hit quote instead of edit. Please delete.
#6 zombiegleemax Dec 24, 2003 3:28:28	Originally posted by ferratus Less plausible as a final death though, given that Crynus was putting his body parts back together when they were hacked off. Personally I think that having a fully intact body get up to merely replace the head is something that's vastly different than having a body that's been solidly frozen as though exposed to liquid nitrogen and shattered into thousands of quarter-sized pieces. It's about as plausible for him to recover from that as it is for his ashes to lump themselves together. But hey, that's just me. ;)
#7 zombiegleemax Dec 24, 2003 7:27:48	Well, there's also the picture we've got now, of what appears to be lightning coming from the dragons mouth, explained away with a metamagic feat... what are her stats? Maybe she knows a spell or a feat that lets her change the form of her breath weapon. Although that's game mechanics used to fit a story. I'd rather she breathed ice instead.
#8 zombiegleemax Dec 24, 2003 7:59:42	I think the ice is a simpler, cleaner solution. However, if it's problematic, I propose this for the fire... Make it a spell, presumably a fireball (or a metamagicked one to appear as a cone shape). When finished, have the silver explain that all dragons can cast magic - Rather than all can breathe fire. It's easy to see how, down through the times, this quote could've been misinterpretted by storytellers on down the line to instead be 'All dragons can breath fire'. And 'except whites' tacked on there somewhere. Point is, it'd put LoH the novels as a sort of 'this is the story', and the comics as 'this is the truth', which is a handy way to retcon anything that needs to be retconned - Like the dragon's fire attack. Whichever way you wanna do it is cool with me. But I think ice is better to avoid confusing people.
#9 zombiegleemax Dec 24, 2003 8:09:09	Whoops. Double post.
#10 zombiegleemax Dec 24, 2003 10:16:59	Haven't we all seen fiery explosions? I think the ice-explosion idea should be entertained solely because it would Look So Impressive! Wow. What a challenge for your artists - draw up a warlord frozen be liquid nitro - not so tough, right? - now draw him shattering into a million pieces. This has the potential to be a really stunning page, and really let Roaring's people flex their artistic muscles.
#11 wardragon Dec 24, 2003 13:26:15	Howdy all, long time lurker, first time poster, big DragonLance fan. Forgive me if I sound like a presumptuous newbie, but I may have a solution; the Draconomicon has "metabreath spells" that let a dragon change the energy of its breath weapon, in the same manner as the "Energy Substitution" or "Energy Admixture" feats. So, why not have the silver explain that she's using magic to alter her breath?
#12 darthsylver Dec 24, 2003 13:35:04	Darn. Just got that book and was going to suggest this, but wardragon beat me to it.
#13 wardragon Dec 24, 2003 13:37:55	Sorry to steal your thunder, darthsylver; I was just a little suprised that no one had mentioned it already!
#14 zombiegleemax Dec 24, 2003 13:40:55	I think it's been mentioned in another thread ;) But I always strive for the simplest solutions, since it's not always a good idea to assume that the readership knows the mechanics. But it's definitely a possibility, and one that fits nicely into the system. I just think ice is a simpler, cleaner, and (as Maofeng put it) a more interesting one.
#15 darthsylver Dec 24, 2003 14:10:34	Someone had said something like this but I think they were saying use metamagic feats.
#16 banshee Dec 24, 2003 14:19:03	Originally posted by Dragonhelm Hey, gang! I'm working on the Legend of Huma comic adaptation, and as I'm looking ahead, I've got a bit of a dilemma. On pages 271-272, the heroes face off against the warlord Crynus. The silver dragon breathes fire on Crynus, and he goes out in a burst of flame. The silver dragon explains that all dragons, save whites, can do this. Obviously, this is one of those errors in continuity that snuck in, as silver dragons breathe a cone of cold. I want to fix this for the comic adaptation, so I thought I would get some input from you guys. The first possible solution is that the silver dragon casts a fire spell, rather than using her breath weapon. The upside is that it fits the story, and maintains continuity. The downside is that a spell isn't as taxing as a breath weapon, and it isn't as cool of a visual. Option two that I have is that the silver dragon breathes a cone of cold on Crynus, he turns to ice, then explodes - sending ice shards everywhere. What do you guys think of these options, and do you have any other ideas on how to handle this? I don't know that this was a continuity error. In The Legend of Huma, the silver dragon explains that all dragons except for the whites can breath fire. But if it's not normally a fire breathing dragon (not a red or gold), then it takes way more out of the dragon. In game effects, I used to rule that instead of taking 1d4 rounds to use the breath weapon again, the dragon who used fire must wait a full 10 rounds, and the breath only does half normal damage. So, if that silver was normally doing 20d10+10 frost damage with the cold breath weapon, she could also choose fire, but it would only do 10d10+5, and she'd need to wait another 10 rounds before using any breath weapons again. Personally, I always figured it was Dragonlance flavour, and made the dragons of Krynn far cooler. Besides, who ever heard of a dragon that doesn't breath fire? ;) Banshee
#17 zombiegleemax Dec 24, 2003 18:47:29	I have to go with WarDragon's idea. That's what I was going to suggest myself. All dragons could breath fire then...but it's a skill (which is what I always took it as in the book anyway) rather than a really difficult innate ability.
#18 Dragonhelm Dec 24, 2003 21:27:25	Originally posted by pddisc Well, there's also the picture we've got now, of what appears to be lightning coming from the dragons mouth, explained away with a metamagic feat... That actually was a bit of a joke on my part moreso than an actual explanation. However, I think Energy Admixture would be a plausable explanation. Remember, guys, comics are like novels in that they don't always follow game mechanics to a T. I am trying to put a little of the gaming side in, though, so you might find some cool little tidbits. Well, it looks like we've got a lot of good feedback going, which has been extremely helpful. The "freeze Crynus to ice and watch him explode" option seems the most popular, but the "metabreath" solution also seems good. If you have any more ideas, keep them coming!
#19 cam_banks Dec 24, 2003 22:05:06	I recommend going with the frost breath solution, with an equally permanent end to Crynus. I would also recommend sending Rick Knaak an email to see what he says, given that he originally wrote that "all dragons except white dragons can breathe fire if they really want to" statement. Cheers, Cam
#20 The_White_Sorcerer Dec 24, 2003 22:05:29	Originally posted by Dragonhelm The "freeze Crynus to ice and watch him explode" option seems the most popular... That's because it would look so darn COOL! (no pun intended)
#21 Dragonhelm Dec 24, 2003 22:40:38	Originally posted by Cam Banks I recommend going with the frost breath solution, with an equally permanent end to Crynus. I would also recommend sending Rick Knaak an email to see what he says, given that he originally wrote that "all dragons except white dragons can breathe fire if they really want to" statement. Cheers, Cam Definitely going to e-mail Mr. Knaak on this one to get his input. White Sorcerer - Agreed!
#22 zombiegleemax Dec 26, 2003 22:55:46	I agree with the ice thing. I re-read this book not too long ago, and did sorta an errata to the book. For one, I assume you'll replace all of the refernces of the Age of Dreams to the Age of Starbirth, will you not? Now, the Triumvirate: I have always been a fan of Habbakuk representing the Crown Knights, Kiri-Jolith the Sword Knights, and Paladine the Rose Knights. Unfortunately, I have found no other references to this, except in an old piece of gaming material I read a long time ago that said that Sword Knights casted like clerics of Kiri-Jolith and Rose Knights changed into casting like Rose Knights. Finally, I think that, if only in the background, it should show Sword and Rose Knights casting magic during battle and such. That was one part I would have really liked to have been in the book. But, if I'm not mistaken, at that point in time, Sword and Rose Knights didn't cast spells, so it's not Knaak's fault.