Any Ideas?
Of course, here's an idea (although not sure if it'll work via DS magics): permanently enchante the hull with a sort of "silt apathy/repulsion" type spell. It forever hovers over the silt, no psi needed, and uses the winds to fly. Or make the hull out of a material that naturally repulses silt. But those are just my crazy ideas
Originally posted by Grummore
IMO, floating silt skimmer are the exception. There are few of these and owned by merchant houses and templars. Skimmer with wheels are the common ships over the sea of silt.
Thats Why I like the idea of Schooners on sand and silt And the Skimmers to ride the waves
Skimmers to ride the waves
Not to be a stickler, especially if you were speaking in metaphore, but on the silt, there are no waves or wake created by something moving through it.
I like the idea of floating ships (Balic's Fleet was composed of several of these ships in the Prism Pentad), but I also think that they should be rare and an exception to the rule. It should take some mighty potent psions working in tandem to achieve the levetation of something so large for that kind of duration and that kind of power won't come so cheap to your average PC party. Depending upon the detail of your campaign, you may have to rethink and rework your economic trade routes to take into account the ease of floating barge travel if you make them more available. Also, there would be no reason why one couldn't simply float a vessel from the silt sea over to the shoreline, turning a ship into a land based military weapon. Also, if the availablity of such levitation is common, it would also be applied to more than just silt schooners; mekillot wagons would quickly become obsolete as they would be considered more dangerous and far slower in travel compared to a levitated wagon.
A work-around for including them, but not having them be disruptive to a normal campaign would be rather simple. Andropinis was the original creator of the devices that were installed onto his most sound ships. The process was lengthy, dangerous, and very costly, even for a SK. The devices still required the power of several psions working together to keep the vessel afloat. Now that old Andro has been sent on a forced sabbatical into the Black for the next millenia, the secret to creating these floating vessels is lost. The ships that remain are prized treasures. Most are held by the Merchant Lords of Balic, but a couple may have been stolen or even sold off to who-ever the DM wants (I was thinking of Nibenay stripping out the levitating device to power his new war machine/floating throne; you know, so he can come out of hiding away in the Naggaramakan in style).
Having said that, I agree with Mach that the inclusion of airships (or just floatable skimmers) would have a major effect on travel, commence and war. This speaks against introducing them, except perhaps as rare artifacts.
In my campaign, I play with the idea of having Dregoth arise with an army of airships. While going a bit against canon, it would be cool
Otherwise, I agree with Mach, if these still existed, there would be no reason for mekillot and other beasts of burden pulling wagons.
There is a d20 supplement called airships detailing the use of such. I assume it contains extensive information on how to construct them using various spells. It has recieved very good reviews at ENWorld.
Actually, I can attest that for a couple of bucks, Airships was a good buy. Not the best artwork in the world, but I'm not a stickler for pretty stuff like that anyway. I did want to do something with actual flying ships based on one of Strutinan's ideas of a psionically floating city state (which in turn brought up some Skyrealms of Jorune nostalgia), which popped in my head when glancing at the book in a store. As of yet its collecting dust, but someday I'll pull it from the shelf and start on that city-state in the sky . . .
Another point to consider is that the silt ships actually did float on the silt and not in the air above it. They worked based on creating the delusion that the ship was floating on the water. So they were not, technically, airships. So if you were to take these things on, say, sand instead of silt, they would quickly be abrated away to nothing. Thus, they aren't really useful beyond the pearly, soft Sea of Silt.
All in my own opinion, of course, and it HAS been close to ten years since I read that series.
Originally posted by Dawnstealer
[b]If I remember Obsidian Oracle correctly, the silt ships were driven by huge obsidian spheres. Keeping consistant with other DS "obsidian magic," I'd say that the obsidian would have to be a perfect sphere of rather large size (pro'lly based on the size of the vessel to be floated). Getting your hands on such an object would be fairly difficult and prohibitively expensive.
Another point to consider is that the silt ships actually did float on the silt and not in the air above it. They worked based on creating the delusion that the ship was floating on the water. So they were not, technically, airships. So if you were to take these things on, say, sand instead of silt, they would quickly be abrated away to nothing. Thus, they aren't really useful beyond the pearly, soft Sea of Silt.
EXACTLY
Btw Mach, what are you doing here? ;) The Silly frog still have is whip! Work, work faster!!! :D
Originally posted by Mach2.5
I did want to do something with actual flying ships based on one of Strutinan's ideas of a psionically floating city state (which in turn brought up some Skyrealms of Jorune nostalgia), which popped in my head when glancing at the book in a store.
Might want to check Barsoom as well. Not sure what Mars book it was, still on the first one myself, but there is mention of floating cities.
Secrets of the Deadlands mentions floating elven cities as well that are further to the north.
Anyway, you get the picture.
Originally posted by Dawnstealer
I want to say that Saragar mentioned something about that, as well.
Guess I'll have to read that tonight since I remember that as well.
Originally posted by Jihun-Nish
True silt skimmers...Hmmm... then why not... Sail skimmers. You know, those surfboards with a sail!! Why not have them magicaly/psionically levitating(hovering1 foot above ground or toutching silt level but never sink--unless destroyed) Desert sailers could be cool. Of course no wind=big trouble. Thats why it should never be your only method of transportation. An air cleric could even imbue an emergency gust spell in case the wind would suddenly die for a long period of time.
Anyway, you get the picture.
Read Raiders of the Chanth. It has your Sail Skimmers. Forget what their called. I'll send you a copy I have it saved on disc
Secrets of the Deadlands mentions floating elven cities as well that are further to the north
Well, you know there smarty pants, not all of us have security clearence high enough to access this Top Secret SI document.
Might want to check Barsoom as well. Not sure what Mars book it was, still on the first one myself, but there is mention of floating cities
I started reading the first book in the series, but moved and forgot about it. Been meaning to pick it up again, especially to check out the reverse DS references.
Read Raiders of the Chanth. It has your Sail Skimmers.
The sail skimmers, called wind howdahs, were empowered semi-sentient magic items, appearing (at least by way of the picture since no actual size is ever given) to be about 7-10' wide bowl shaped skifs with a kind of 'wind surfing' sail rising from the center. The moved by way of levitating upwards, then the wind adds any momenum. But, as anyone whose ever done wind surfing can tell you, direction is entirely dependent upon which way the wind blows. In short, they would never be able to be used for navigational purposes they way they are described. Now, I'm not sure how much it would cost in the psi-handbook to create one of these, but a permanent intelligent magical carpet of levitating with additions? Probably not very cheap.
I never ran the adventure itself, since I thought the wind surfing (no pun) was a little contrived. Then came the Mind Lord and its surfing druids. Had I known then, I would have just started a tropical beach resort for the PCs in the Tablelands with bikini babes, drunken campfires, and bad accustic songs . . . instead I keep those in my own life (well, except for the babes . . . and the campfires, but drunken accoustic guitars surely fits).
Originally posted by Mach2.5
Well, you know there smarty pants, not all of us have security clearence high enough to access this Top Secret SI document.
Perks are a good thing. :D
From what I've heard, but never seen, it's a hodgepodge of half-conceived ideas, location sketches, and so on. Even so, as a GM of 10+ years of this world, seeing the original notes would be extremely interesting.
Then again I could be mistaken, but I thought that was the plan.
ooooh bad question for all of those Surfer Druid life shape hating folk out there.
Surfers? Bad. Life shapes? Good!
One of the interior pictures of Windrider's of the Jagged Cliffs shows some kind of stange life-shaped vehicle skimming the waters of Athas during the Blue Age. Unfortunately, since the wastelands and silt sea didn't come about until after the Rhual-than had already begun their downward spiral into ritualistic ignorance, I doubt that any of the lifeshapers would have been able to devise that kind of contraption. So, while it would be cool, I don't think it would fit logically.
Just a thought.
To bad Mindë is to weak to remind(Obliviously of course ;) ) the Rhul-thaun how to *grow* them.
The thing is though, that propeller isn't just running at a few hundred rpm. It takes a heck of a lot of force to get one of those suckers moving across land. As far as I know, they're not as good over varied terrain either (hills and such). Flat surfaces are fine, but too many hills or even sand dunes and you capsize the thing.
But how would you get a lifeshape that comes close to a hovercraft? It still has to work on a biological level. I can see it possible over the sea using water jets.
Originally posted by Mach2.5
Hovercraft.But how would you get a lifeshape that comes close to a hovercraft? It still has to work on a biological level. I can see it possible over the sea using water jets.
All right here's an idea. Now for those who have a copie of the WRotJC, open it on page 26(you should see a pic of a Rhulisti boat--hovercraft-)
The hovercraft of the Rhul-thaun would look quite similar with only three *modification*
lets start with what we can see(and assume) on the picture.
1---The Rhul-Thaun version would have 26 tubulus holes(see front of the boat in the pic) all aroud it for the purpose of air intake and also for fast and short burst maneuvers(any direction).
2--- when the air is inhaled into the creature it is then exhaled through several artificial lungs(working in coordination for a constant air suply) into a strange blader which makes the whole underbelly of the hovercrat.
2.1-- inside the blader are 4 special glands which secrete a liquid that when mixed with air, a chemical reaction occurs: the air is heated to searing hot and is lighter then air(similar to helium on earth)
3-- If one could flip the life-shaped hovercrat to reveal it's underbelly the onlooker would see a thick membrane protecting the belly-blader. He would also discover 6 valve-like toothless mouths skatered equally on the membrane used for air surplus to escape. The second purpose is to help the Life-shaped creature to hover and second controle maneuvers: the valves act as hot air jets.
4---unlike any other hovercrats the propultion device is not situated in the back of the boat, but rather under it in the form of a thousand insect-like legs about 4 inches long.
how it works
the Rhul-thaun can master the organic hovercraft by manipulating the strange controles situated on top of what look like an alien elephant head.
He starts by stimulating the lung inhalers for the life-shape creature to hover. At this point the thousand legs are no longuer supporting the creature and are now free for their true purpose:propultion.
The leg stimulators can then be manipulated in any direction the controler desire.
An important notice would be to mention that the Organic hovercraft is boneless. It is rather cartilaginous making the said creature lighter and more supple which permits it to overcome small to medium obstacles.(very similar to the cilop)
If you look on the side of the organic vehicule you'll notice 2 tubulus apandages which seem blocked by some sort of eyelid looking membrane(one big, one small) I like to think their purpose is for offence or defense(see the bird like life-shaped creature flying around the hovercraft in the pic.)
One last thing. The strange crest on each dorsal side of the vehicule are,like many other creature, for cooling purpose. To prevent the life-shaped hovercraft from burning from the inside out.
there hope you like it.
that said I realy doupt the Rhul-thaun could have a practical use for it: unless they want to venture more frequently into the swamp below.
Originally posted by Mach2.5
I like the intake/output idea. Not too fond of the chemical mixture aspects. Plus, such a thing wouldn't be able to float over silt; the silt underneath it would keep giving way until you reach the compacted surface. It would be possible though to use it over sand. I would leave silt travel to flying/levitating means.
Thanks and true enough. Since this thread is about SILT skimmers, one would expect to read the Organic hovercraft to skim on silt not just on water and land but, being a Rhulisti life-shape vehicule, they dont.( silt was, to my thinking, nonexistant in the Blue Age. and the early green age other then the covering ocean/sea floor.)
Ho and might as well......... I second Mach. Great idea Jihun!! :D
I'm not saying there might not be any of those artifacts, just that it would be like looking for the proverbial needle, in a haystack the size of Malibu beach.
Originally posted by xlorepdarkhelm
Long ago doesn't seem to do it justice. You're talking about artifacts from an age that was around over 8,000 years ago (IIRC). The organic technology was a Blue Age deal... It's been a long time since the Blue Age was around.
I'm not saying there might not be any of those artifacts, just that it would be like looking for the proverbial needle, in a haystack the size of Malibu beach.
Granted, but the halflings along the Jagged Cliffs make use of all kinds of ancient biotech, even if they've lost the ability to make or repair it. It coud make for an inteseting adventure if say an evil halfling was banished from his village, who have such a biotech device, and sells them out to some adventurers. He promises the PCs a remarkable device to power their ships, in exchange they have to help him "avenge his people who were wiped out by these other halflings". Bad guy gets his revenge, PCs get the doohickey, and you have a potetially recurring villain if the evil halfling tries to double cross the PCs and he gets away. I think it's workable.
BTW, I like the flying chariot idea. Cloud rays might fit the bill. Plus, just like ground travel, you'd still have the constant concern over whether your trusty mount is going to get a little rumble in its belly and eat you.
Originally posted by Mach2.5
Canon speaking, the halfings have lost the ability to create anything new with any hope of success. The stuff they can create is all from at least a few thousand years ago, they simply replicate the proccesses without any real understanding of what they're doing. Rather like someone copying down a quantum equation to the point of memorizing it, but not knowing the basics of 2+2. Still, canon aside, I'm not too sure the cliff dwelling halfings would even want to build something like this, since they don't venture away from their little cliff dwellings, and even then they have their big floating whale thingies (I forget the name).
BTW, I like the flying chariot idea. Cloud rays might fit the bill. Plus, just like ground travel, you'd still have the constant concern over whether your trusty mount is going to get a little rumble in its belly and eat you.
Well, like you said, they may have the means to make something without the knowledge of its proper use, say using it to levitate a priests/chiefs throne for effect instead of as a means of propulsion for a larger vessel.
The chariot idea has always been a favorite of mine. It just seems to me to be a natural extention of the use of draft animals when you have large animals that can fly or cross space, just hitch a ride.