The fallout of course would be pretty large, but we felt that it would open up some rather large doors for plots involving the Gith etc. Also with Vlaakith's demise, there would no longer be the level/HD cap on Githyanki characters, both NPCs and PC's alike. You now would have a greater opportunity to play a Githyanki without them very likely being a renegade. No more knights and gish hunting them down and killing them, etc.
I'm not sure of the status of the Red Dragon pact, though I think that the Rod of Ephelemon (sp?) was shattered with Vlaakith's death and thus the pact was null and void. There's TONS of ways we could proceed with the aftermath, including plot lines for both the Githyanki and Githzerei alike.
There's now the opportunity for 'yanki to worship deities as well without incuring the wrath of the Lich Queen. That of course opens up a can of worms plot-wise. *chuckle* I havn't had a ton of involvement here, nor would I likely have much involvement in those plotlines at the moment unless I got asked. I'd need to do some reading on them seriously to get the depth of knowledge needed. If I remember correctly, we're going to eventually go for a book/release on both Gith races, but I don't recall where on the priority list that is after we put out all of the Core setting material.
Take my words with a grain of salt obviously
As I recall, there's a post on Planewalker asking readers whether they'd rather see a book on the planetouched or gith races first. Needless to say, my vote's with the gith.
The Adventure "The Lich-Queen's Beloved" is the machinations of a powerful Githyanki warlord who is a member of a splinter group among the Githyanki and Githzeri who feel their races should've never broken apart. So in the midst of her campaign and race for Godhood Vlaakith is vulnerable. It cna be run with either Gith or non-gith PC's.
Who know's maybe Gith will re-emerge from the pits of the Nine Hells!!! She always said, "I'll be baack."
It was Dungeon 100 & Dragon #309
I've already had open warfare breakout between the Githyanki and the Psurlon, and had Tu'narath burning last time anyone knew what was going on. The PC's have stayed away from the issue, but its been hinted at that the war was purposefully instigated to keep Vlaakith's eyes and attention focused away from a Yugoloth operation to mine the dead gods of the plane, including the corpse of Aoskar using Ghyris Vast's Divinity Leech. Directed by the consort of the Oinoloth, the entire operation may itself be manipulated unbeknowst to the 'loths by one or more of the Baern.
Of course if I have Vlaakith deposed during this, it's very VERY tempting to have a re-emergent Gith erupt out of Baator with all the fury of a betrayed racial savior. But it'd be largely window dressing as the plotline is progressing is a different direction from there, with a considerably larger scale.
Thinking about how powerful the Psurlons are, and figuring in that the Githyanki would now be without their Red Dragon allies, I'd think such a war would end up with the Githyanki being slaughtored by the Psurlons, and the survivors settling on either the Prime or the Outer Planes(Acheron and the Outlands most likely).
First of all I would like to say I enjoy reading your posts they stand out, and you seem well informed of planar things
secondly
This plot to manipulate dead gods intrigues me I am running the Incursion campaign and placing the plot you suggested might make for an interesting twist and could be fit into the game.
Aoskar sounds familiar who is that again? and direct me to some info on Oinoloth, any other details of this plot would be appreciated.
I am new to the plane stuff having used a lot of my own ideas and only recently added planescape material to my game.
Thanks
aspectuscape
You see, Aoskar was the god of portals and every traveller who used a portal spoke a prayer to his name. Eventually he was the patron of Planewalkers and the city of SIgil itself. Then one day, the Lady's Dabus Fell took up the mantle of Aoskar's clergy and that was it. Aoskar died instantly, all of Aoskar's clergy died except for Fell. Fell was forever cast out the dabus warrens, forever forced to walk on the ground and not above it as a true dabus. That was eons ago and he still lives, still has clerical magic and the power of a proxy of Aoskar despite the deities death. They say Aoskar's corpse floats on the Astral, pierced through with massive, familiar looking blades.
Fell currently is a member of the Will of One, a splinter cell of the Sign of One who wish to reawaken a deity (namely the God of Portals) sing only their minds. Fell holds sermons at night and owns a Tattoo shop using his innate ability to afix his rhebus symbols to surfaces.
---
Some ask how it was that Aoskar was slain by the Lady since he wasn't allowed inside the City due to the Lady's deity ban. The Lady's power seems to be restricted to Sigil though no evidence proves this. It is my opinion that Her Dread Majesty lured the Portal Master in, opening a portal for him to step through for but a moment. As Aoskar stepped in, possibly to bless his new priest Fell, the Lady struck destroying him with her flaying shadow of ultimate death.
((Why don't more Dusties
off the Lady? That's the truest True Death there is!)) *revels in the flattery*Primus told about all there is with Aoskar. In my own game I had his corpse sitting at the eye of a massic psionic storm in the astral, with the entire region considered 'cursed' by the Githyanki and Psurlon alike.
The Oinoloth is detailed in the 3e MotP, and the 2e Planescape 'Planes of Conflict' box and the supplement 'Faces of Evil: The Fiends'. However in my own campaign I had both Anthraxus and Mydianchlarus killed off and replaced. I also had the Tower of Incarnate Pain in Carceri experience a change in leadership with both Bubonix and Cholerix 'vanishing' and being presumed dead.
Thanks! I'll have to do some reading but the ideas sound good!
aspectuscape
Aka I'm bored out of my Yugolothy skull at the moment and this helps alleviate it
Why am I thinking UFO: Aftermath, only in a fantasy setting with githyanki instead of reticulans? Or is this more aftermath of Vlaakith's death?
And with her evil nature, thats power shes got to be using for no good!
Anyway, so the story of Vlaakith's destruction in the module is actually quite disappointing. You'd think that major planar figures should get major planar deaths that are exciting to hear about. Except Primus, who doesn't deserve any attention at all.
So, with Vlaakith dead and no heir named, I can't help but wonder whose banner the githyanki will rally under. This could very, very, very easily open up an entry for another gith civil war. Unless, that is, Gith makes a miraculous return.
On a rather different topic -- since it was brought up, where can a rilmani find information about the Tower of Incarnate Pain?
Hey! When I died the Modrons marched, berk! Now THAT'S attention getting!
Anyone know where they put that Iron Shadow thing? I might wanna borrow a little.
"In fact unlike all her predecessors this Vlaakith is a litch, has no
heirs, and in her undead state is unable to produce them." - A guide
to the Astral Plane
Well, not necesarily. It is quite possible (though granted highly
unlikely) to obtain a bone splinter, whisp of hair, bit of old flesh,
whatever and then use the spell clone to um well make a clone. Then all you have to do is get Joe Shmo Githyanki make a little magic (the kind that doesn't need wizards or priests) and voila, we have an heir.
Of course there are a few slight problems here. The first one of course is obtaining the sample from the Queen who probably is none too keen on this idea, especially considering she destroys Githyanki who rise in power so they won't be a threat to her.
The second problem relates to that as well, she of course isn't going to be like "oh well I guess you are the heir and all, heres the keys to the palace theres juice in the ice box"
So the whole affair is likely to lead to massive civil war.
---End---
I think the 'loth tower on Carceri is discussed in Planes of Conflict
Originally posted by Sword_Of_Geddon
If Aosker did die because of the lady, then that means shes stronger than the GODS!!!!!!!
And with her evil nature, thats power shes got to be using for no good!
Most assume that The Lady is true neutral. Personally I would put Her above alignments in some measure. She's pragmatic. If the actions She takes to control and safeguard Sigil are good, so be it. If they're evil, so be it. She's unconcerned with morality, only the end result.
Of course we have little to go on besides Her actions and some edicts at around five centuries or so on average between them. Thats a rather small sample to judge alignment on in game. Out of game I'd go for Neutral if I had to pick an alignment, but its a neutral thats unconcerned about alignment for the most part it would seem. Tons of room for speculation here aside from what I think. I'm not claiming my opinion is the right one or the sole one by any stretch of the imagination here.
The Lady doesn't use Her power randomly either. It's only been used towards the goal of safeguarding Sigil (the city, not really the residents per say. I could honestly see her mazing the entire population and not blinking if a threat to the city ever made that a necessity) and preventing the deities from taking control of the portals. Yes She's killed at least one extraordinarily powerful greater god and almost all of his followers in a matter of seconds, but at the same time She's also shown a seeming mercy, or maybe respect for the proper role and place of the divine within the multiverse when one one occasion forced a newborne deity out of Sigil when She could have flayed them. (One of the results of 'Harbinger House') Or it may have simply been easier to shunt them out of the nearest portal rather than kill them. The newborne deity in question assumed divinity rather suddenly and had not intended malice towards Sigil.
The gates of Sigil remain barred simultaneously to every single deity in the entirety of the planes. Think about it. Start with that level of power and then realize for all of it's history, the City of Doors has been a rather safe place when compared to a good many other planar cities. That doesn't really speak of evil to me. And believe me, I can tell you about evil. :D
*shrugs* lots of speculation, few concrete answers
There's a picture of it in the latter of the two.
*mutters about stupid Apomps and stupid Gehreleths destroying it every time we get close to finishing it*
I wouldn't put a wager on it, but the picture in the 3e MotP for Carceri may actually be derived from the Tower of Incarnate Pain. It seems to fit with the squirming bodies of petitioners and all, rather than any of the other locales detailed in the book. Always been curious if the pic was a nod to us Planescape folks.
Deal with the it.
Screw it, I don't care anymore.
I'm with you, Ryltar. Long live the lich-queen!
Originally posted by overtrick
I'm with you, Ryltar. Long live the lich-queen!
Overtrick, you're only saying that because if you didn't, you'd get unfriendly visits in the night by some mean-looking gentlemen with silver swords.
ing english language. You can print out of every page of Planewalker and then pee on them and tell me and I wouldn't bat an eye except to go... "Ew."I don't care if you think the Lich-Queen is alive. I don't care if she's dead. No, I don't. But don't misuse words. You ruin our lexicon if you go about altering meaning all willy nilly! And I go crazy!!! SEMANTICS WHY HAVE YOU FAILED ME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Originally posted by Primus, the One and Prime
I don't care if you think the Lich-Queen is alive. I don't care if she's dead. No, I don't. But don't misuse words. You ruin our lexicon if you go about altering meaning all willy nilly! And I go crazy!!! SEMANTICS WHY HAVE YOU FAILED ME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Um, she was a lich anyway, she wasn't alive, she merely existed! *ducks thrown secundus*
Query: What were the events surrounding her death?
Ahem.
Edit: Ignore this gibbering son of Gith. primemover003 has already informed us all of this Incursion thing.
I'm not going to argue with you Ryltar, or I'll at least try to avoid doing so since I respect your knowledge on most planar topics and you're one of the number of folks I can rely upon for informative postings on this board and others on WotC. *heaps on the flattery in typical Arcanaloth fashion*
And Primus, you get bonus points for actually using the word lexicon in a post. :D
I was initially against whacking Vlaakith but my vote so to speak got altered over the course of the discussions on it all. I'm also keeping in mind the wisdom of arguing with a man who uses a particularly mean looking Blackguard as his icon. ;)
(We need more Tony D art for icons here)
Originally posted by Primus, the One and Prime
Out of character. I wanted to punch him. Sooooo much.
Ah yes, then we can see you 'just totally flip out and kill everyone' it would be so awesome. ;) (gets the image of Primus in totally sweet ninja gear displaying his real ultimate power)
*snicker*
Is the One and the Prime supposed to act so emotional? I thought beings who reprisented ultimate law didn't have emotions?
I think he just overheated, that's all. ;)
*mehehe*
Originally posted by Shemeska the Marauder
I wouldn't put a wager on it, but the picture in the 3e MotP for Carceri may actually be derived from the Tower of Incarnate Pain. It seems to fit with the squirming bodies of petitioners and all, rather than any of the other locales detailed in the book. Always been curious if the pic was a nod to us Planescape folks.
Actually Shemeshka that's the Fortress of Indifference, home to the Nalfeshnee Tapheon (who's taking up about three pages of the Dead Book IMC). This was in the Hellbound adventure Squaring the Circle... My PC's were disgusted by the description (and pictures) I gave them!
I dunno, maybe you're right. I certainly remember the fortress of indifference, but the picture in question was for Carceri and not the Abyss. That alone made me discount Tapheon's former lair as a possibility for the subject of the pic. The resemblance though does fit it as I remember it.
To save me the effort of looking up the picture in the Hellbound 'Visions of War' art booklet, does the MotP picture closely resemble the picture of the fortress of indifference? It may have just been a goof that it got pegged onto the Carceri section. This is one of the times that I wish the writers of the books wandered these boards occasionally like some of the FR novel writers graciously do on those respective boards.
I stand corrected. *reluctant scowl* ;)
However WotC has sinned even more, they misspelled Yugoloth on that page as Yogoloth. *eyebrow*
Second, it wasn't my intention to start an argument. I merely wished to inform those that might not know that Vlaakith's death was debatable given the open ending of the adventure.
*grin*
They messed up on a few other things too in the art galleries. There's some pictures that got switched for others. The Revenant in Monsters of FR is switched with the Yaun-Ti for instance.
When I was playing in a game that ran through that module we had an interesting time there. We had already gotten the Vuulge, but my character and another of the PC's decided to stay and free as many of the people trapped in the walls of the tower before they died and became Bodaks. Irony had that the paladin of Tyr was infuriated and just wanted to leave (yes he ended up getting his powers yanked permenantly before the campaign was over).
Well, we finally realized we could barely make a dent in the number of prisoners and so my character got out his most valuable posession, a ring of 3 wishes with a single wish intact. The DM was in a sadistic mood and I worded it badly. "I want everyone trapped within the walls of the Fortress of Indifference to be transported back to their homes."
It worked, sadly also on the freaking Bodaks too *grumble and mutter*
That went over poorly and the fallout would haunt us morally and financially for quite some time. ;)
Originally posted by Shemeska the Marauder
Irony had that the paladin of Tyr was infuriated and just wanted to leave (yes he ended up getting his powers yanked permenantly before the campaign was over).
*snort* Ok, I was playing the rogue of the party and *I* was the one putting his foot down saying, "24 hours? Ha. You wanna leave because we can't do it in that time - well forget you, I have 24 hours I'm gonna Use em! Stupid paladin." (I still can't believe you people bought it when I said, "If we're going to work together - I'm leader and I get first pick of the gems." You were letting the 17 yr old in leather call the shots!? *boggle*)
Originally posted by Shemeska the Marauder
That went over poorly and the fallout would haunt us morally and financially for quite some time. ;)
You? Haunt you? I stole those gems out of the throne fair and square while the rest of you were cleaning up the mess... *grumble* I paid for the resurections of the victims myself, you had naught to do with it, fuzzy face.
I did like the adventure though - very nicely done. *Creepy* tower.
*throws Clueless in a room with three tiefling goons*
"Well Mr. Clueless. Won't you find it difficult to scream if you .. have ... no.. mouth?"
Sorry, couldn't resist ;)
Does this mean I'll be sleeping on the floor instead of the couch this weekend now?
Originally posted by primemover003
Incursion is actually a Campaign that's damned interesting. Basically Vlaakith finds the homeworld of the Gith races and their former deity in some wierd stasis. Vlaakith decides to siphon the divintiy out of the goddess, but to do so she must keep the eyes of the world off her plot. So she orders the Invasion of the world! She chooses a nation or kingdom far from her real objective... It's all a big ruse, a smoke screen.
The Adventure "The Lich-Queen's Beloved" is the machinations of a powerful Githyanki warlord who is a member of a splinter group among the Githyanki and Githzeri who feel their races should've never broken apart. So in the midst of her campaign and race for Godhood Vlaakith is vulnerable. It cna be run with either Gith or non-gith PC's.
Who know's maybe Gith will re-emerge from the pits of the Nine Hells!!! She always said, "I'll be baack."
It was Dungeon 100 & Dragon #309
I have Dungeon 100, but not Dragon 309...what is in Dragon #309?
Edit: ignore me, I do have Dragon 309...my friend left it here.