So, I'm starting a new D&D campaign, and have decided to set it in Oerth for nostalgia's sake. I haven't played in a Greyhawk campaign since ToEE came out, and it seemed like it would be fun.
The basic plot of the game is this: A cabal of vampires are attempting to blot out the sun, and cast Oerth into eternal night. They will do this by first discrediting the "Sun Gods" (Pholtus, Pelor) and once they've disillusioned their worshippers, they will kill or imprison the gods.
Epic stuff. I see this campaign playing out with the PCs starting off at first level, and going all the way up to 20th, or maybe into epic levels.
I've chosen the Pale to start the game off in for a number of reasons. I like the idea of a kingdom devoted to one deity. Their worship of Pholtus seems to be an ideal place to begin the plot (near as I can tell, there's no other area on Oerth with such a high concentration of sun god worshippers).
And everything I've read in the LGG plus a few other sources make it seem like there's enough stuff going on in and around the Pale to make this a workable campaign.
Now, I'm not a Greyhawk expert, but a few of my players seem to know a lot about the world.
I'm wondering if any of you guys see any problems with the plot I've described above, and could point them out to me, so I can start thinking about them.
Thanks!
My one question is, who is your head vampire villian? January's Dragon Magazine #315 has Strahd von Zarovich of Ravenloft fame in two deadly 3.5 Ed. guises. I recommend looking at him, particularly the second manifestation of Zarovich - very, very deadly. We have recently been discussing Count Zarovich and Pholtus in THIS THREAD.
Let us know how this develops. It sounds exciting.
I'll probably create a badguy from scratch, and hopefully be able to foreshadow him early in the game.
I'm imagining an adventure where the PCs are sent to the "Tomb of the Vampire King" to retrieve some powerful artifact. They'll fight through his legion of skeletons, mummies, etc... but when they finally reach the tomb itself, they'll find it empty... no trace of the vampire...
Which will lead to the inevitable realization, that he's been up and around for a while now, but nobody knew about it... plotting his revenge in secret... muahahahahahah!
The basic plot of the game is this: A cabal of vampires are attempting to blot out the sun, and cast Oerth into eternal night. They will do this by first discrediting the "Sun Gods" (Pholtus, Pelor) and once they've disillusioned their worshippers, they will kill or imprison the gods.
Sounds alot like an episode of Angel. The beast is summoned and he searches through all of californa for thr Ra-Tet. An ancient order of individuals who each hold a key piece of an arifact that can blot out the sun.
The beast is indestructable until he casts the spell and uses the completed artifact to blot out the sun. He then makes a knife out of his own horn for his master the first evil. While the sun is out vampires own the state.
Before the beast is summoned their are some signs of his arrival. First you get things like birds flying into buildings and minor quakes.
Anyhow the only way to kill the beast is to stab him with his own knife (the one he made for his master). When the beast is killed the sun is once again present.
So you can steal a little bit from Josh Whedon and make it stick in your campaign.
Originally posted by zomben
They will do this by first discrediting the "Sun Gods" (Pholtus, Pelor) and once they've disillusioned their worshippers, they will kill or imprison the gods.
Well, it may be tough for a Greyhawk-phile to believe any of the Palish followers of Pholtus to become easily disillusioned with their deity. Also, for Pholtus, the sun isn't the prime area of his interest. Rigidity of law really is. The sun and moons fall into Pholtus' interest because on Greyhawk they so precisely rise and set, eclipse, wax and wane that they are the ultimate symbols of Pholtus' doctrine of inflexibility.
To hit at a Palish faith in Pholtus, have the sun rise at the wrong time of a day. Then have the moons take too long to cycle through its phases. And have the Palish priests be unable to explain it. That would be a good start towards believable disillusionment with Pholtus' teachings.
Regards,
Eric Anondson
At first, it's not even going to seem like they're abandoning Pholtus, just the rigidity of the physical presence of the church...
But once they've thrown off the shackles of the church, it will be that much easier to steer them away from Pholtus all together. Bit by bit his followers will abandon him for other gods.
Again, this is all in the planning stages right now, and I appreciate any and all input. I really see this whole thing taking a _long_ time to play out. I imagine if I start the PCs at first level, by the time they hit about 15th, the church will topple. They will then be racing against the clock to try and save Pholtus & Pelor from imprisonment or death. They'll hit level 20 just about the time the "Scheme" is about to be enacted, and have to wade through an army of vampires to storm their citadel and save the two sun gods.
Again, slow, subtle ramp up, fast, epic conclusion... What do you think?
While some fans believe that Tharizdun is overused, It seems a good fit for your plot to extinguish Liga (Greyspace's name for Oerth's sun). Also Tharizdun has major beef with Pelor. ;)
What you've planned for the Theocracy of the Pale sounds nice, and I really liked Eric's suggestions for disrupting the lunar and solar cycles. Since you prefer to hold that one for later, you might introduce a twin-tailed comet early in the campaign. Also, remember that the clergies of Istus, Lendor, and Cyndor will be highly interested in (and likely extra-sensitive to) disruptions of Oerth's natural order (as will servants of Beory, of course).
I'll pitch Zarovich as developed in Dragon 315, again. Adding to Marc's comments, use some Ravenloft material, themes and game mechanics to develop your night-stalking villains. But, change the names to suit your specific and unique concept of the setting. It can save you some work (besides thinking of new names) and add some depth and personality you might not have thought of.
I may just use Strahd's stats, and rename him to "protect the innocent" so to speak. I've picked up Green Ronin's "Fang and Fury" sourcebook on vampires, and got a ton of great ideas from that.
Honestly, a lot of the inspiration for this campaign is drawn from a book I just finished writing for the "All Flesh Must Be Eaten" RPG. So, I'm not lacking in ispiration more I'm hunting for information.
Thanks again for all the great ideas!
Anyway, back on topic - let us know how it goes, zomben. And definitely post more questions, if they come up. And when it comes to changing Zarovich's name, it is more like protecting the guilty!
Heh heh... yeah, no worries on pimping Ravenloft. It's a great world, with lots of good stuff. But as far as coming up with ideas for Gothic horror plots, I've got no problems there. I've been a long-time fan of games like Call of Cthulhu, and the horror genre in general, so that won't be a problem.
What I really want to make certain of, is that the villains are interesting, not just faceless vampires with the same powers. Fang & Fury has a ton of great new prestige classes, feats and magic that will make sure my NPCs are unique and interesting. Nothing worse than the PCs just rolling their eyes "Oh, another vampire. Grab the holy water and crucifixes..."
Ah, yes, the Illithid triad of modules, starting with the nice
A Darkness Gathering module.
Arguably, it's a far cry from a vampire cabal but there were a few good ideas about frightened commoners and all
If you're thinking about basing this on a conflict with the churches of Pelor and Pholtus, remember the former isn't very happy with the latter currently (mainly for what Pelor sees as a theft of portfolio)
Sort of like the old "The Monsters Are Here on Maple St." story, if anyone's read that....
However, the clergy of Cuthbert have beef with Pholtans...
If you'd like to keep the focus on Pholtus and Pelor, however, you might incorporate Gary Holian's idea that Pelor names an ancient religion amongst the Oeridians -- that of Sol. This was described most thoroughly in the LGJ issue that introduced the Death Knights of Oerth. Since Sol worship is so old, perhaps clergy of Pholtus "usurped" it within the Great Kingdom of Aerdy?
Cosmologically, Pelor is superior to Pholtus. (Pelor may even be the "Blinding Light" that Pholtus seeks to regulate!)
not realy, they belong to different pantheons.
Pelor is a Flan god (although commonly worshiped across the flanaess), and Pholtus is an oeridian god.
Pelor is definitely a member of the Flan pantheon. His nature and demeanor are indications of that affiliation. On the same token, Pholtus screams Oeridian, to which he is a member.
Perhaps Marc is referring to the fact that Pelor is a Greater God, while Pholtus is Intermediate in power. In this case, one can safely assume that Pelor is the superior, in a manner of speaking.
I do like the Cuthbertine idea. Maybe some Cuthbertine ideoloques (rogue clerics) instigate, turn a blind eye to, out right asist, etc., onerous events in the Pale.
Since both cults have similar views on upholding the Law, it was only logical they would compete. Methink when the Great Kingdom lost its western "colonies", St-Cuthbert moved in to capitalize on the fact that Pholtus wasn't very popular as he was seen as the enforcer of the Overking's will (that was long ago, obviously).
There could even have been some kind of secret agreement between the two deities to "share" the Flanaess between them.
As for Pelor and Pholtus having different divine ranks and different origins, what does it matter? For the last centuries, cults have become mixed all over the Flanaess. Apart from some Suel gods who still support the idea of a Suel people living apart from everyone else, the majority of the other gods seem to be perfectly happy with worshippers hailing from the different (human) races. It's not longer quality but quantity that matters.
Moreover, Pholtus's portfolio includes the moons because their cycle is based on cosmic laws. Some of his worshippers have tried to add the sun in the equation .. which didn't endear them to Pelor's followers.
Let's not forget that worshippers don't always do what's best for their god. In this case, folks from the Pale deadset on making Pholtus the one and only Sun god have probably placed him in a difficult position towards Pelor.
Another thing to consider is the theory outlined in the old Spelljammer Greyspace accessory about two suns having existed eons ago. One (Liga) still active, and the other (anti-Liga) having disappeared the gods know where.
If whoever was responsible for destroying anti-Liga needed to recover from the strain of blowing up one sun (undeads are very good candidates here), it might explain why your vampires reappared only recently ("one done, one to go!").
I'm more and more beginning to think that the central theme of this campaign is to be two similar religions vying for power, and the vampires swooping in as opportunists to destroy them both.
Also, I'm thinking that the head vampire may now be a high-ranking member of the Pholtan clergy who turned from the church as he felt their doctrines were too restrictive. He was then killed as a heretic but then raised as a vampire somehow... still working out the details...
Yeah, I was referring to the old? system of ranking deities; in either 1e or 2e terms, Pelor ranks above Pholtus.
Cuthbert worship does seem centered in Old Ferrond, but reportedly Cuthbert worshippers supported Nyrond's conquest of the Theocracy of the Pale too.
I like Mortepierre's suggestion that the Pholtans were identified with the Overking's will. Combining Ivid with the LGG, prior to the change in the Holy See, Pholtans likely controlled the courts of law.
IMC, however, there are no "secret agreements" between gods. Their relationships are inscrutable to mortals though many myths, legends, and mystery plays describe their ways.
Although I don't own Greyspace, from what I've read online, anti-Liga seems related to the binding of Tharizdun...
Then several thousand years ago, Anti-Liga disappeared one day. No hard info on why, how or when exactly. One theory only: Anti-Liga "drifted" out of its orbit and struck a nearby planet. Anti-Liga was destroyed and the planet reduced to rubbles (the current asteroid field known as the Grinder )
Good thing to know about, however. I'll keep it in mind. Thanks!
Then the (Anti-Liga) can accept the souls of the faithless (any who don't share his beliefs) and reunite him and Pholtus under the one true light.
Originally posted by zomben
Hey all,
So, I'm starting a new D&D campaign, and have decided to set it in Oerth for nostalgia's sake. I haven't played in a Greyhawk campaign since ToEE came out, and it seemed like it would be fun.
The basic plot of the game is this: A cabal of vampires are attempting to blot out the sun, and cast Oerth into eternal night. They will do this by first discrediting the "Sun Gods" (Pholtus, Pelor) and once they've disillusioned their worshippers, they will kill or imprison the gods.
Epic stuff. I see this campaign playing out with the PCs starting off at first level, and going all the way up to 20th, or maybe into epic levels.
I've chosen the Pale to start the game off in for a number of reasons. I like the idea of a kingdom devoted to one deity. Their worship of Pholtus seems to be an ideal place to begin the plot (near as I can tell, there's no other area on Oerth with such a high concentration of sun god worshippers).
And everything I've read in the LGG plus a few other sources make it seem like there's enough stuff going on in and around the Pale to make this a workable campaign.
Now, I'm not a Greyhawk expert, but a few of my players seem to know a lot about the world.
I'm wondering if any of you guys see any problems with the plot I've described above, and could point them out to me, so I can start thinking about them.
Thanks!
*Plotting to steal zomben's campaign idea*
J/K, It does sound tight though. You got some imagination there zomben. ;)
~B4Real
;)
Lots of this stuff was inspired by things I was thinking about when I wrote the book "One of the Living" for Eden Studios' "All Flesh Must Be Eaten" RPG... just sort of bubbled to the surface...