So it's possible.
They have the following races, that I noticed, from Star*Drive:
Fraal (though, instead of being tall aliens, they look like they're short)
Weren (under the Sasquatch entry)
Seshayan
N'sss
Kra'ath
Garidyi
They don't have the T'sa and the Mechalus, as far as I could tell.
Still, you start out with four of the player-character races (including humans) and three of the enemy races (though having the Klicks would have been nice...).
Plus, they include some futuristic weapons...
Daryl B.
Official Alternity Fansite
Official Stardrive Fansite
Did you really think WOTC was going to re-invent the wheel.
Star Drive and dark Matter had it all.
Most of D20 Future will be a compilation of D20 Star Wars, D20 Gamma World, D20 Modern, D20 Star Frontiers, Alternity, and 3rd Ed.
The fraal were never tall, but in ALTERNITY they were about 5 ft. tall, putting them into the Medium rather than Small size range.
JD Wiker said klicks might make it into D20 Future, but they might end up getting cut
Those things were such popular bad guys that I think they really should make it into the book, or at least a web enhancement.All those species from Alternity, Star Frontiers, Buck Rogers (when was the last time someone mentioned that game?) can be added in a supplement at a low cost to you.
No mecha please. I have never liked the cartoon shows or the game I played once to check it out.
Future settings that include space exploration are fun. Hope they include races from Star Trek and what hybrid possibilities there are. Do you think they'll include a planet generation table?
Buck Rogers suffered from the stupid name which reminded people of either the Buster Crab stuff or the quirky show with Gil Gerard. (They actually had some good episodes). The actual RPG was pretty good. The computer RPG by SSI was outstanding.
For the price of the book, D20 Future better come with a pre generated universe with some unexplored planets. The planet generator could be accessed from the web site supporting the product.
Originally posted by beavis123
I don't care for Mecha either. I don't see role-playing from inside a 60 ton walking tank.
I have, but I don't care for Palladium's Megaversal System (when they published Robotech RPG line). :P
Buck Rogers suffered from the stupid name which reminded people of either the Buster Crab stuff or the quirky show with Gil Gerard. (They actually had some good episodes). The actual RPG was pretty good. The computer RPG by SSI was outstanding.
Which is ironic, considering that a relative of the creator -- a niece, I believe -- was actually responsible for the 1990's downfall of TSR.
But many of us dare not utter the true name of whom we dubbed the "Lady of Pain." :P
For the price of the book, D20 Future better come with a pre generated universe with some unexplored planets. The planet generator could be accessed from the web site supporting the product.
All I'm looking for is the "Home Depot of Toolkit" for use in any and all futuristic genres. If it happens to have a chapter presenting three campaign models (the same approach they did with d20 Modern) to start you n00bs off right away, then that's all right with me.
D20 Future doesn't have that luxury. They will still have to have a default universe. Detail can be left on the web site supporting it. (which it better have)
Also, D20 Future would love to draw everything from Alternity. Not the system but all the source material. Some people would scream to pay big bucks for a book with old material.
D20 Modern didn't have alot of competition to really challenge them. Some people talk about Spycraft.
D20 Future has some competition from alot of sources, including D20 StarWars, D20 Gammaworld and even the Alternity community.
Without support from a web site, D20 Future has no future!!!
Originally posted by beavis123
Also, D20 Future would love to draw everything from Alternity. Not the system but all the source material. Some people would scream to pay big bucks for a book with old material.
What about TSR's other product, Star Frontier. They got some good material in that old game.
Star Frontiers, although I loved it, is not as complete as Alternity. I own a lot of the old modules and would love to see them run in the new D20 format, especially Dark Side of the Moon.
I think that it is my favorite setting. Despite its Pulp flavor, the technology and societies were very well thought out.
And I've noticed that it's main components, Ability scores coupled with General then Career Skills were most likely the precursors for the Alternity system, which itself was the precursor for the D20 system.
Seeing a Buck Rogers D20 (or Alternity) enhancement would be really cool.
I never played the PNP RPG, but loved both computer games by SSI.
After picking up Alternity (also on Ebay) I do see alot of the similarities.
After so many sci-fi rpgs, I would be surprised to find anything new in D20 Future.
In fact, the only new idea, would to actually advertise it!!!
Originally posted by Tikon2000
Seeing a Buck Rogers D20 (or Alternity) enhancement would be really cool.
As long as that Lady of Pain is not involved. Lorraine William was responsible for the financial downfall of TSR (who became the management head in the 90's), who also happens to be related to the late Flint Dille, creator of Buck Rogers, and therefore a trustee of the Dille Estate.
Yeah, sometimes it sucks to see the business side of RPG industry.
As for the klicks, if they're not in this book, I'll be extremely surprised. My PC's hate them, and they're fantastic as villains due to the fact that many PC's don't think they are intelligent based entirely off of their appearance. You should have seen their faces when the things whipped out blacklaser SMG's and started mowing down Concord marines left and right!
I will wait to hear the comments and maybe wait for the price to come down. I want to see the campaign settings and if there are any new ideas before I drop the amount they asking for.
Personally, this is going to be a fairly large TOOLKIT supplement, but when it comes to science fiction and futuristic genre, it may not be enough to cover everything, unless they used 7.5-point typeface for the body text.
But I will buy the book.
ie. it may not have every single StarDrive weapon, alien, armor, or cyber-implant, but it should at least give you a blueprint as to how they work and compare to d20 Modern items of the same nature.
Let's just say I was kind of shocked to find that the StarDrive weapons presented in the Menace Manual were actually more powerful than I anticipated.
I think it's published by Guardians of Order.
Personally, the vehicle creation ruleset rocks (yes, vehicle -- you can make a 16th-century sailing ship). I prefer GoO's version over the Mecha Crusade mecha creation. But when it comes to character classes, I'll stick with Mecha Crusade.
Ah what cool memories with my players !!!
Originally posted by Griselame
Well it would be very nice because Alternity is the true basis to D20 system after all ...
I don't recall any of the game designers stating that. AFAIC, they built the rules system from the ground up with reference to AD&D.
Even if Star*Drive isn't the most original universe , others that came after don't match it (except maybe Transhuman Space) , and I miss these good old Alternity rules for SF and space-opera...
Ah what cool memories with my players !!!
What about those that came before? Gamma World (the Pre-Alternity versions)? Star Frontier?
They have a campaign model for StarDrive, as well as all the Alternity alien races, yes, ALL of them. This uses the d20 Modern rules, which aren't too bad. Also, they have an advanced class for the Concord Administrator.
I'm picking up the book in about 1 hour so I should have more to post then for those of you interested in its contents.
The entire starships chapter is based off Alternity ship systems, classes, hull types, weapons, armor, etc. etc. They even have templates from the Starships book!
All the races are ready for play, including the fraal, weren, t'sa, mechalus, and sesheyans. The Klicks are in there too, as is the Concord Administrator advanced class.
Cybernetics is good, not great, but good.
The gear chapter is fantastic. The gadget system they use to personalize weapons and armor is really cool.
Mutations are covered as well, almost exactly as presented in Alternity (you get mutation points from taking harmful mutations to purchase good ones).
Robots, very cool.
8 new occupations, new uses for 8 skills, 30 new feats (lots of spaceship ones) 12 new advanced classes, not including the ones in the campaign models
As usual...
Dang it...
Originally posted by Tembo-Pie
Wow! d20 Future is crammed full of so much Alternity material I can't believe they just didn't call it d20 Alternity!
Would you hate me if I say, "W00t!" ?
d20 Alternity would be an odd title to go with the series that include d20 Modern and coming soon, d20 Past.
d20 Future Campaigns
I'm looking forward to the book. Glad to see the mechalus will be in there.
Wow! d20 Future is crammed full of so much Alternity material I can't believe they just didn't call it d20 Alternity!\
Well I for one will stick with the Alternity ruleset for my Stardrive games. If they come up with some new setting resources and not just a rehash of old material I might consider purchasing something. Until then it is not worth my time or money to purchase anything that uses the d20 system which I've grown to dislike more and more each time I play it.
Well I for one will stick with the Alternity ruleset for my Stardrive games. If they come up with some new setting resources and not just a rehash of old material I might consider purchasing something. Until then it is not worth my time or money to purchase anything that uses the d20 system which I've grown to dislike more and more each time I play it.
And so say all of us
I liked Alternity a lot when it first came out, but after we played a few sessions the flaws of the system became evident, and many of my players gave up on the ruleset. Is it more realistic and deadly? Yes, of course. Is it easier to use? No way.
)I LOVE D20 SYSTEM!!!
(Yes, I'm wearing my feel-good jeans from Old Navy.)
I don't think that at all. The d20 System is extremely well done for many reasons. The main thing I like about it is the ease of use. GM's don't have to spend hours upon hours throwing together stats for monsters/NPC's and adventures like they did in Alternity.
I liked Alternity a lot when it first came out, but after we played a few sessions the flaws of the system became evident, and many of my players gave up on the ruleset. Is it more realistic and deadly? Yes, of course. Is it easier to use? No way.
I don't see how the d20 system is inherently faster in creating adventures/creatures/NPCs from scratch. I don't see the basis for your argument here.
As for your experience with Alternity I can't say I shared this same path on this one. I think Alternity is extemely easy to gamemaster and a more satisfying ruleset in my eyes. D20 combat is way too slow and I'm not fond of its emphasis on miniature rules. It's a step up from old D&D but doesn't compare favorably to the Alternity rules.
I guess we will have to agree to disagree and enjoy the StarDrive setting with whatever system we find acceptable.
Well, I hope they offer a new Star*Drive campaign sourcebook in the near future for the new generation, as well as those generations that missed it the first time around. (Yes, I'm trying to buy "oh-so-very" OOP products from eBay but I have not yet hacked into crucible's credit account ... I'm making progress though!
I LOVE D20 SYSTEM!!!
(Yes, I'm wearing my feel-good jeans from Old Navy.)
Well, that's obvious.
I for one hope they provide a new Star*Drive sourcebook for the d20 crowd so they can join in the fun and help create new campaign material. The setting is very rich and can be enjoyed with whatever ruleset you prefer. www.tequilastarrise.net is a great place to visit on the web for fan discussion on the Star*Drive universe. It is has mostly Alternity enthusiasts but if you stick to setting discussion I don't think anyone will bite.
Speaking of OOP products I purchased every Star*Drive book when they came out so you can choke on that, sucker! :D Of course one of the most satisfying Star*Drive products that ties up a lot of loose ends (and adds a lot more) can only be purchased as a download from rpgnow or some other site allowed to sell it. Externals was the last gasp of the Star*Drive line and it was well worth the purchase.
Bring on the new Star*Drive resources! I'll just jettison the d20 material and use the rest.
Bring on the new Star*Drive resources! I'll just jettison the d20 material and use the rest.
You mean the same way I use the GURPS worldbooks supplements for my D&D/d20 games? Well-written stuff but you'd have to turn me into an animated undead to play GURPS.
That aside, a d20 StarDrive book would be fantastic. Judging from the fact that about 80% of the material in the d20 Future book is ported over from StarDrive in some sense, its safe to say that I dont' think we've seen the end of this product line just yet.
And if you liked the Externals download, check out the second Externals pdf made by fans to continue the second year of that war! Its quite good, so good that at first I thought it was done by TSR originally, until I double checked the author
And if you liked the Externals download, check out the second Externals pdf made by fans to continue the second year of that war! Its quite good, so good that at first I thought it was done by TSR originally, until I double checked the author
Cool. Where is this download available? I think I know which writeup you are talking about but just in case I would like to check it out to be sure.
You mean the same way I use the GURPS worldbooks supplements for my D&D/d20 games? Well-written stuff but you'd have to turn me into an animated undead to play GURPS.
I hear you. In that same vein a person could take the StarDrive material and get rid of the Alternity ruleset for their d20 Future games. There's a lot of good stuff out there right now and it may take a while (if at all) for d20 to cover that goodness. I am even part of a Stellar Nations project that is attempting to flesh out the core nations and most of the material is not beholden to a ruleset. The Profit Confederation (StarMech, Austrins, Rigunmor, Union of Sol) was released and can be downloaded at www.tequilastarrise.net if anyone is interested in a StarDrive expansion. The other nations will hopefully follow in a year or two.
Cool. Where is this download available? I think I know which writeup you are talking about but just in case I would like to check it out to be sure.
Over here.
http://www.tequilastarrise.net/downloads/Miscellaneous/X-Final-02.pdf
Being a big fan of Alternity and Star*Drive but also the d20 System (love D&D 3e and pretty okay with d20 Modern) helps me keep perspective on turning Star*Drive into a d20 campaign. After purchasing (and then printing up) The Externals, I had big plans to run an External War campaign. Would love to see the looks on players' faces when they see the real masters of the I'krl Theocracy.
Still, there were some sore points to the book. The starships section doesn't really tell how to build a ship (how much does it cost for each hit point, how do you determine what the defense is per size, etc.), only a list of premade ships and systems, and that is one of the first things I look for in a sci-fi game. The mecha chapter, ripped from Mecha Crusade almost entirely, is even worse. The Mecha Crusade idea of building mecha didn't appeal to me (I used everything but the mecha creation section and combat when I ran a Mecha Crusade game), as it didn't feel at all realistic or believable to me. Now, the vehicles section, I didn't have much expectations for and was a little taken with one of the items (the hoverboard) but the vehicle gear just felt...incomplete.
Those were the sore points. What d20 Future held for me was the keys to unlocking Star*Drive again. I can change hit points to wound and vitality points and armor bonus to just providing damage reduction, so that it continued to use hit points and armor bonus are just minor points. The equipment section, while having all sorts of cool new armors, gear, and weapons, also brought a nice surprise: gadgets! They remind me of templates, only not as complex (templates are one of my favorite things about the d20 system, too, but they can make for some headaches sometimes) and add more options when purchasing equipment. I actually found most of the other chapters of options (such as the one on mutations and cybernetics) to be pretty decent (though I intend to employ a different method for determining how many cybernetic attachments one can have; the system used is too weak).
With what was in this book and using the d20 Mecha rules for powered armor, mecha, vehicles, and starships, I can put all those Star*Drive books back to use (and I have all of them, not to mention all of the Alternity and Darkmatter books). I'll change a bit of the Concord Administrator class (really, they simplied that career, didn't they?), but all in all, I have enough to convert Star*Drive to d20 Modern.
For the starships, I heard they may release more of that chapter as a web enchancement, as well as an entire chapter on net running and computer stuff that they axed from the book. I'm planning on integrating pieces of the StarWars revised starship rules into my stardrive campaign, mostly to do with firing arcs, ship sizes, and piloting maneuvers, to make it more compatible with the vehicle combat rules and less miniatures oriented.
On a side note, are there any larger attempts at converting Star*Drive to D20? I know there's been lots of attempts at converting Darkmatter, but haven't seen anything on Star*Drive online.
I'll probably have to do a lot of the psionics too from the Mindwalkers book as I have a Fraal in my gaming group who's itching to get his psionics into d20 Modern rules. Other than that, there isn't much else that really needs to be covered unless someone can find any mutations or cyberware that were not covered in d20 Future.
Converting the psionics system from Alternity's skill-based system to D20 Modern's spell-like system seems rather unfair. Probably the best bet is to create a mindwalking hero base class, then leave the psionic skills as just that, with the rank benefits as feats. That's how I plan to implement it (and I'll be working that out here after converting the powered armors to D20 Mecha). Since Alternity used ranks for skills, it's fairly easy to convert, there's just no level cap. Now, adapting psionic advanced classes to that system, that's another trick altogether.
When you get the doc finished, I'd love to take a look over it, see if yours seems a little better in damage than some of the D20 Future versions. Also want my sabot and render weapons. :D Just email it to [email]vampyrknight@other-realities.org[/email]. Thanks a lot.