What do you think of the Guide to the Shadow Fey? - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

What do you think of the Guide to the Shadow Fey?

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
ylem
Mar 21, 2004 3:14:29 On the whole, I liked it, even though I was somewhat disappointed that the authors didn't produce any new characters as original as Toben the Many. (An NPC who made the Guide to the Walking Dead particularly memorable.) The authors did try to develop the characters of Laurie and Gennifer in ways that gave the book some life. For instance, I enjoyed the way Gennifer reacted to the sound of a Fey howling in wolf form by remembering the exhilaration of her own first kill, and then how she quickly tries to justify her own odd reaction to herself and the reader. It was a clever way of showing how Gennifer's status as an infected werewolf affects her thinking in ways she doesn't quite understand. I thought the authors needed to be a little more careful to keep their portrayal of Gennifer and Laurie consistent with what had been written about them before. For instance, at one point , on page 35, they have Gennifer casting arcane eye, a fourth level spell, 4 time in one night. She would have to be a 10th level Wizard to do that, and according to Van Richten's Arsenal, Gennifer is only a 2nd level Wizard. I suppose they could justify this somehow, either by having the twins advance in level very rapidly, or perhaps by giving her a magic device that allowed her to repeatedly cast that spell, but the point is they didn't care enough to either make the effort needed to keep their characterization of Gennifer's abilities consistant with what had already been written, or else explain to the reader what they were changing. I hope they try to be a little more careful how they describe their most important NPC's in the future.
#2
rucht_lilavivat
Mar 23, 2004 8:24:36 There are a number of reviews for Van Richten's Guide to the Shadow Fey at the Fraternity of Shadows website. Check 'em out here:

http://www.fraternityofshadows.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=695

Oh, and I'm shamelessly plugging this new book. Shamelessly. I'm very happy about it.
#3
zombiegleemax
Mar 24, 2004 3:50:15 The first person perspective doesnt work for me. I prefer the style of the Ravenloft core rulebook and DMG. Bits of it are entertaining, but this 'colour' just distracts me from what i want to know. So generally I consider these guides to be mostly padding.

The rules and guides at the back are good. My next campaign will include the Shadow Rift.

My latest campaign is for characters level 18+ I will be using the Shadow fey and the Shadow Rift as the adventuring ground.

You can bet there will be epic level fey. I reckon about 40th level for the rulers of the Seelie and Unseelie courts will do, though I will impose a level cap outside of the rift (so all 21st+ level characters become 20th level outside the Rift, and magic items of epic standards become the best none-epic that can be managed) which should give the party plenty of reason to go into that place.
#4
nofearcavalier
Mar 24, 2004 21:32:52 Ylem,

I'm glad you liked the passage on Gennifer's reaction to the howling. I had a lot of fun writing that chapter of the book; I really enjoyed developing the character of the twins.

I can't explain the inconsistency on p. 35; I didn't work on that chapter. You are correct, though, that Gennifer is not 10th level. However, the twins are a year older in this book than they were in Van Richten's Arsenal.

Regards,
Brett King
#5
zombiegleemax
Mar 25, 2004 6:44:49 I was finally able to get a copy of the book last night; my friendly not-so-local gamestore had sold out of the three copies they had before I was able to drive the 70 miles to get one, so I bought it on Amazon. I haven't done more than scan through it so far and read the introduction. I'm sure that I will like this one, but someone please tell me that the editing & proof-reading gets better. On the very first two pages of the book, Rudolph van Richten is spelled 'Ritchen' (rhymes with kitchen) 4 times! I really hope that the rest of the book doesn't prove to be that distracting! I do like the art, especially Talon Dunning & Claudio Pozas.
#6
zombiegleemax
Mar 25, 2004 9:47:14 Feel free to blame any mistakes in Shadow Fey on the developers. We applaud all our writers -- Rucht Lilavivat, Brett King, Tadd McDivitt and Penny Williams -- for a job well done!
Thanks, folks!

Jackie Cassada and Nicky Rea

PS -- Did "Ritchen" really slip by the two of us AND our editor???
Yeesh.
#7
zombiegleemax
Mar 25, 2004 15:56:35
Originally posted by Grimfondle
The first person perspective doesnt work for me. I prefer the style of the Ravenloft core rulebook and DMG. Bits of it are entertaining, but this 'colour' just distracts me from what i want to know. So generally I consider these guides to be mostly padding.

FWIW, the first-person style of the Van Richten's Guides are a well-established Ravenloft tradition going back a little over a decade now. Still, de gustibus and all.
#8
zombiegleemax
Mar 25, 2004 17:55:25 I always preferred the stories that said the Shadow Rift was a gaping pit to nowhere; a netherspace that could not be claimed by anyone as a domain. But, it's better now to know what is supposed to be in there, canonically speaking. I've enjoyed what I've seen of the book, and it once again makes me wish I could advance the timeline in my campaign a little more quickly. We started in 735, almost five years ago, and we've basically progressed one year for every year real time (very unintentionally). That means that I'll have to wait almost another year before my character's will even HEAR about the Shadow Rift!!!

Thanks to everyone involved in putting out this fresher, newer material. The Guides series lured me into Ravenloft, and I am so glad to see it prospering. I'll buy them right up until the Guide to Shambling Mound...Or until Van Richten's Guide to Vampires, ver.3.5 starts the whole series over again...
#9
rucht_lilavivat
Mar 25, 2004 22:27:37
Originally posted by Chaderick
I always preferred the stories that said the Shadow Rift was a gaping pit to nowhere; a netherspace that could not be claimed by anyone as a domain.

That pesky Shadow Rift book that came out in '97 put a damper on that. ;) I kid, of course. In any case, you definately will find out alot more about it in Gaz V, but if you absolutely can't wait, I would highly recommend trying to find a copy of The Shadow Rift. It's complete with goreous maps, illustrations, and lots of "forbidden info." I still see it in gaming stores from time to time when I'm travelling about.
#10
zombiegleemax
Mar 26, 2004 2:38:36
Originally posted by Brandi
FWIW, the first-person style of the Van Richten's Guides are a well-established Ravenloft tradition going back a little over a decade now. Still, de gustibus and all.

So what? Just because something is established does not mean we have to like it.

As i said, there is some stuff in it to inspire, but i really dont give a hoot for the twins or what happened to the good Doctor.
#11
zombiegleemax
Mar 26, 2004 2:40:50
Originally posted by Chaderick
(I) wish I could advance the timeline in my campaign a little more quickly. We started in 735, almost five years ago, and we've basically progressed one year for every year real time (very unintentionally). That means that I'll have to wait almost another year before my character's will even HEAR about the Shadow Rift!!!

The mists do strange things....have the mists take them forward in time.
#12
zombiegleemax
Mar 26, 2004 7:56:56
Originally posted by Rucht_Lilavivat
That pesky Shadow Rift book that came out in '97 put a damper on that. ;) I kid, of course. In any case, you definately will find out alot more about it in Gaz V, but if you absolutely can't wait, I would highly recommend trying to find a copy of The Shadow Rift. It's complete with goreous maps, illustrations, and lots of "forbidden info." I still see it in gaming stores from time to time when I'm travelling about.

Heh!

I actually put off buying Shadow Rift by well over a year when it first came out, because I was so dead set against it. Of course, in the long run, I caved and bought it. It's a very interesting--and extremely involved--concept. In my last campaign, I went my own way and turned the Rift into a break in reality, a place where arch-devils almost broke through into the material plane...through the demi-plane...during the Grand Conjunction. This time around, I think I'll probably do something closer to the company line...
#13
zombiegleemax
Mar 26, 2004 7:59:13
Originally posted by Grimfondle
The mists do strange things....have the mists take them forward in time.

Ah, but then they would miss the resolution of a few other plotlines. And I've already messed quite a bit with time in this campaign, running the Dark Minstrel adventure from Book of Crypts and giving the characters an artifact that links them to a pocket domain known as "The Island at the End of Time." It's weird, but they bought into it, and they're extremely creeped out by it since their ally there is an alternate-reality version of their archenemy...
#14
Darrius_Adler
Mar 26, 2004 10:10:41 I really enjoyed reading this book but ran into a slight problem. Since no one else has mentioned it I am beginning to wonder if I got a flawed copy of the book. I wanted to design a unique fey but found the Weakenesses list a CR modifier while the Salient Abilities in Chapter 3 do not. A few of the CR adjustments show up in the sample creation of the Glimmer Bones on pg 101 - 103. The rest seem to be missing. Maybe the authors could list the missing CR adjustments.
#15
zombiegleemax
Mar 26, 2004 11:51:15
Originally posted by Grimfondle
So what? Just because something is established does not mean we have to like it.

Way to not read my last sentence.
#16
zombiegleemax
Mar 28, 2004 2:30:40 I give it a thumbs up, but I didn't think it was as original or good as the Guide to the Walking Dead.

The art was solid. As many other people, I really like Talon's art. I thought most of the other art as well was very good. Though I don't care that much for Pozas' rendition of the Sith, he nailed the rest especially the Teg and the Alven.

I would agree with Ylem that a fey example like Toben the Many would have been welcome. I didn't find the clockmaker all that vibrant. I have a hard time seeing how a woman with her deformities could survive or prosper among typical RL natives. In my RL such a person would have been driven into the outskirts of society at best. Its also not clear to me how she typifies being fey. The illustrations of the "swan-man" make we wish we'd had him to be "our guide". The pictures of him were haunting.

I think the book might have benifited from being a guide to fey in general rather than such a focus on the shadow fey. In some ways the book felt like an update of the Shadow Rift, minus the juicy adventure parts (though the nod to the guardian was a nice touch). I'm really not sure how much activity the shadow fey should have outside of Tepest. Sylvan Fey would have been more approriate IMO for the Falkovnia hunt at the end (unless there are other passages into and out of the rift). Given the dangers of sunlight for the shadow fey outside the Rift I would tend to think that even the cruelest wouldn't be eager to leave its safety for casual sport. Only for their prince and Queen, or deeper agendas. A deeper look at the life (and rivalries?) in the courts would have been welcome. As it was IMO we saw deeper into the minds of Loht and Maeve, and their minions, in the 97 product (which, okay I know not everyone has).

-Eric Gorman

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 ylem Mar 21, 2004 3:14:29	On the whole, I liked it, even though I was somewhat disappointed that the authors didn't produce any new characters as original as Toben the Many. (An NPC who made the Guide to the Walking Dead particularly memorable.) The authors did try to develop the characters of Laurie and Gennifer in ways that gave the book some life. For instance, I enjoyed the way Gennifer reacted to the sound of a Fey howling in wolf form by remembering the exhilaration of her own first kill, and then how she quickly tries to justify her own odd reaction to herself and the reader. It was a clever way of showing how Gennifer's status as an infected werewolf affects her thinking in ways she doesn't quite understand. I thought the authors needed to be a little more careful to keep their portrayal of Gennifer and Laurie consistent with what had been written about them before. For instance, at one point , on page 35, they have Gennifer casting arcane eye, a fourth level spell, 4 time in one night. She would have to be a 10th level Wizard to do that, and according to Van Richten's Arsenal, Gennifer is only a 2nd level Wizard. I suppose they could justify this somehow, either by having the twins advance in level very rapidly, or perhaps by giving her a magic device that allowed her to repeatedly cast that spell, but the point is they didn't care enough to either make the effort needed to keep their characterization of Gennifer's abilities consistant with what had already been written, or else explain to the reader what they were changing. I hope they try to be a little more careful how they describe their most important NPC's in the future.
#2 rucht_lilavivat Mar 23, 2004 8:24:36	There are a number of reviews for Van Richten's Guide to the Shadow Fey at the Fraternity of Shadows website. Check 'em out here: http://www.fraternityofshadows.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=695 Oh, and I'm shamelessly plugging this new book. Shamelessly. I'm very happy about it.
#3 zombiegleemax Mar 24, 2004 3:50:15	The first person perspective doesnt work for me. I prefer the style of the Ravenloft core rulebook and DMG. Bits of it are entertaining, but this 'colour' just distracts me from what i want to know. So generally I consider these guides to be mostly padding. The rules and guides at the back are good. My next campaign will include the Shadow Rift. My latest campaign is for characters level 18+ I will be using the Shadow fey and the Shadow Rift as the adventuring ground. You can bet there will be epic level fey. I reckon about 40th level for the rulers of the Seelie and Unseelie courts will do, though I will impose a level cap outside of the rift (so all 21st+ level characters become 20th level outside the Rift, and magic items of epic standards become the best none-epic that can be managed) which should give the party plenty of reason to go into that place.
#4 nofearcavalier Mar 24, 2004 21:32:52	Ylem, I'm glad you liked the passage on Gennifer's reaction to the howling. I had a lot of fun writing that chapter of the book; I really enjoyed developing the character of the twins. I can't explain the inconsistency on p. 35; I didn't work on that chapter. You are correct, though, that Gennifer is not 10th level. However, the twins are a year older in this book than they were in Van Richten's Arsenal. Regards, Brett King
#5 zombiegleemax Mar 25, 2004 6:44:49	I was finally able to get a copy of the book last night; my friendly not-so-local gamestore had sold out of the three copies they had before I was able to drive the 70 miles to get one, so I bought it on Amazon. I haven't done more than scan through it so far and read the introduction. I'm sure that I will like this one, but someone please tell me that the editing & proof-reading gets better. On the very first two pages of the book, Rudolph van Richten is spelled 'Ritchen' (rhymes with kitchen) 4 times! I really hope that the rest of the book doesn't prove to be that distracting! I do like the art, especially Talon Dunning & Claudio Pozas.
#6 zombiegleemax Mar 25, 2004 9:47:14	Feel free to blame any mistakes in Shadow Fey on the developers. We applaud all our writers -- Rucht Lilavivat, Brett King, Tadd McDivitt and Penny Williams -- for a job well done! Thanks, folks! Jackie Cassada and Nicky Rea PS -- Did "Ritchen" really slip by the two of us AND our editor??? Yeesh.
#7 zombiegleemax Mar 25, 2004 15:56:35	Originally posted by Grimfondle The first person perspective doesnt work for me. I prefer the style of the Ravenloft core rulebook and DMG. Bits of it are entertaining, but this 'colour' just distracts me from what i want to know. So generally I consider these guides to be mostly padding. FWIW, the first-person style of the Van Richten's Guides are a well-established Ravenloft tradition going back a little over a decade now. Still, de gustibus and all.
#8 zombiegleemax Mar 25, 2004 17:55:25	I always preferred the stories that said the Shadow Rift was a gaping pit to nowhere; a netherspace that could not be claimed by anyone as a domain. But, it's better now to know what is supposed to be in there, canonically speaking. I've enjoyed what I've seen of the book, and it once again makes me wish I could advance the timeline in my campaign a little more quickly. We started in 735, almost five years ago, and we've basically progressed one year for every year real time (very unintentionally). That means that I'll have to wait almost another year before my character's will even HEAR about the Shadow Rift!!! Thanks to everyone involved in putting out this fresher, newer material. The Guides series lured me into Ravenloft, and I am so glad to see it prospering. I'll buy them right up until the Guide to Shambling Mound...Or until Van Richten's Guide to Vampires, ver.3.5 starts the whole series over again...
#9 rucht_lilavivat Mar 25, 2004 22:27:37	Originally posted by Chaderick I always preferred the stories that said the Shadow Rift was a gaping pit to nowhere; a netherspace that could not be claimed by anyone as a domain. That pesky Shadow Rift book that came out in '97 put a damper on that. ;) I kid, of course. In any case, you definately will find out alot more about it in Gaz V, but if you absolutely can't wait, I would highly recommend trying to find a copy of The Shadow Rift. It's complete with goreous maps, illustrations, and lots of "forbidden info." I still see it in gaming stores from time to time when I'm travelling about.
#10 zombiegleemax Mar 26, 2004 2:38:36	Originally posted by Brandi FWIW, the first-person style of the Van Richten's Guides are a well-established Ravenloft tradition going back a little over a decade now. Still, de gustibus and all. So what? Just because something is established does not mean we have to like it. As i said, there is some stuff in it to inspire, but i really dont give a hoot for the twins or what happened to the good Doctor.
#11 zombiegleemax Mar 26, 2004 2:40:50	Originally posted by Chaderick (I) wish I could advance the timeline in my campaign a little more quickly. We started in 735, almost five years ago, and we've basically progressed one year for every year real time (very unintentionally). That means that I'll have to wait almost another year before my character's will even HEAR about the Shadow Rift!!! The mists do strange things....have the mists take them forward in time.
#12 zombiegleemax Mar 26, 2004 7:56:56	Originally posted by Rucht_Lilavivat That pesky Shadow Rift book that came out in '97 put a damper on that. ;) I kid, of course. In any case, you definately will find out alot more about it in Gaz V, but if you absolutely can't wait, I would highly recommend trying to find a copy of The Shadow Rift. It's complete with goreous maps, illustrations, and lots of "forbidden info." I still see it in gaming stores from time to time when I'm travelling about. Heh! I actually put off buying Shadow Rift by well over a year when it first came out, because I was so dead set against it. Of course, in the long run, I caved and bought it. It's a very interesting--and extremely involved--concept. In my last campaign, I went my own way and turned the Rift into a break in reality, a place where arch-devils almost broke through into the material plane...through the demi-plane...during the Grand Conjunction. This time around, I think I'll probably do something closer to the company line...
#13 zombiegleemax Mar 26, 2004 7:59:13	Originally posted by Grimfondle The mists do strange things....have the mists take them forward in time. Ah, but then they would miss the resolution of a few other plotlines. And I've already messed quite a bit with time in this campaign, running the Dark Minstrel adventure from Book of Crypts and giving the characters an artifact that links them to a pocket domain known as "The Island at the End of Time." It's weird, but they bought into it, and they're extremely creeped out by it since their ally there is an alternate-reality version of their archenemy...
#14 Darrius_Adler Mar 26, 2004 10:10:41	I really enjoyed reading this book but ran into a slight problem. Since no one else has mentioned it I am beginning to wonder if I got a flawed copy of the book. I wanted to design a unique fey but found the Weakenesses list a CR modifier while the Salient Abilities in Chapter 3 do not. A few of the CR adjustments show up in the sample creation of the Glimmer Bones on pg 101 - 103. The rest seem to be missing. Maybe the authors could list the missing CR adjustments.
#15 zombiegleemax Mar 26, 2004 11:51:15	Originally posted by Grimfondle So what? Just because something is established does not mean we have to like it. Way to not read my last sentence.
#16 zombiegleemax Mar 28, 2004 2:30:40	I give it a thumbs up, but I didn't think it was as original or good as the Guide to the Walking Dead. The art was solid. As many other people, I really like Talon's art. I thought most of the other art as well was very good. Though I don't care that much for Pozas' rendition of the Sith, he nailed the rest especially the Teg and the Alven. I would agree with Ylem that a fey example like Toben the Many would have been welcome. I didn't find the clockmaker all that vibrant. I have a hard time seeing how a woman with her deformities could survive or prosper among typical RL natives. In my RL such a person would have been driven into the outskirts of society at best. Its also not clear to me how she typifies being fey. The illustrations of the "swan-man" make we wish we'd had him to be "our guide". The pictures of him were haunting. I think the book might have benifited from being a guide to fey in general rather than such a focus on the shadow fey. In some ways the book felt like an update of the Shadow Rift, minus the juicy adventure parts (though the nod to the guardian was a nice touch). I'm really not sure how much activity the shadow fey should have outside of Tepest. Sylvan Fey would have been more approriate IMO for the Falkovnia hunt at the end (unless there are other passages into and out of the rift). Given the dangers of sunlight for the shadow fey outside the Rift I would tend to think that even the cruelest wouldn't be eager to leave its safety for casual sport. Only for their prince and Queen, or deeper agendas. A deeper look at the life (and rivalries?) in the courts would have been welcome. As it was IMO we saw deeper into the minds of Loht and Maeve, and their minions, in the 97 product (which, okay I know not everyone has). -Eric Gorman