Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 Shei-Nad May 03, 2004 19:21:21	Hey, I just had a thought. After reading a few novels and other athasian flavor texts, you get the feel that even the SKs were afraid to challenge the Dragon, and everybody seems to think that there's no way to challenge him (except Sadira). Now that would make sense, since he's a full dragon, is more advanced than anyone else, and has really, really impressive ressources. However, when Eldaarich, or rather Daskinor, ''rebelled'' against the Dragon, the Dragon didn't even try to fight him. Why? And surely, some SKs must have learned that Daskinor had managed to stop the dragon. Why didn't they rebel as well then? Could it be that Daskinor got his hands on some artifact/magic/thingy that could give pause even to the dragon? Any thoughts?
#2 nytcrawlr May 03, 2004 20:01:56	Originally posted by Shei-Nad Could it be that Daskinor got his hands on some artifact/magic/thingy that could give pause even to the dragon? That's my thinking on it. Might be what made him go bonkers too. P.S. Sasser can lick my junk.
#3 Shei-Nad May 03, 2004 21:08:20	Originally posted by NytCrawlr P.S. Sasser can lick my junk. Ah, uh, yes, uh... huh?
#4 nytcrawlr May 03, 2004 21:15:01	Originally posted by Shei-Nad Ah, uh, yes, uh... huh? New XP/Win2k exploit.... Getting slammed with calls... Must kill....
#5 dawnstealer May 03, 2004 22:47:06	Why didn't they rebel as well then? Easy answer to this one: Borys was all that was keeping Rajaat under raps. Borys was the lesser of two evils as far as that was concerned. As for why Borys allowed Daskinor to defy him? If I had to guess, I'd say he pulled a "Sadira" and said: "If you come back here, I'll shatter those spheres in your tummy." And the thing is, he was just crazy enough to do it, Rajaat released or no. So Borys took the wise track and stayed the hell away.
#6 xlorepdarkhelm_dup May 03, 2004 23:27:14	Originally posted by Shei-Nad However, when Eldaarich, or rather Daskinor, ''rebelled'' against the Dragon, the Dragon didn't even try to fight him. Why? It could be a matter of geographical problems. Strange as it may seem, maybe Borys didn't want to keep going that distance for the tribule (was too far out of the way), and when Daskinor rebelled, he might have already been looking for a good reason to just drop Eldaaritch & Kurn like bad habits. I mean, really, those two Sorcere-Kings decided to go *way up there*. Another possibility is the proximity to the Mind Lords. Perhaps Borys sensed their presence further north, as well as the growing madness of Daskinor (combined with the disinterest in continuing the lengthy trek), and just decided it best to leave. And surely, some SKs must have learned that Daskinor had managed to stop the dragon. Why didn't they rebel as well then? Well, Daskinor starts acting loopy. Borys tells everyone when they ask (for whatever reason. Maybe they had some smalltalk about the other cities) that he's gone whacko, his city is in worseshape than Raam, and heading further south. He also seems to be preparing to attack Oronis. Oronis (ever the thespian in this) plays up that Kurn is preparing to attack Eldaaritch. Borys shortly later tells the other SK's to cough up more slaves for the griddle, and says that Eldaaritch & Kurn are no longer an issue. He remains vague, but leaves the impression that the two cities are gone. trade does vanish from that region, and presto, everyone believes (who's gonna argue with the Dragon between the other Sorcerer-Monarchs) borys, thinks they are gone, and adjust their number of slaves for him accordingly. After all, other SK's had died over the years (Sielba, Dregoth, Kalid-Ma, etc.) - their number of slaves keeps increasing because of this, and with 2 more gone, it's even higher. Thus, when Kalak bites it, the others are already upset that they have to keep raising the number of slaves they have, and some cities just might not be able to do it (for long).... Could it be that Daskinor got his hands on some artifact/magic/thingy that could give pause even to the dragon? Or, as Dawn already stated, Daskinor's state of mind could have troubled the dragon enough to give him Pause. Crazy people can do some rather amazing things.
#7 zombiegleemax May 04, 2004 1:02:14	I always figured that Daskinor, while not the strongest magic-user of the SKs, may well have been the most brilliant psion among them. From the wisdom of the drylanders bit on eldaarich, he has some crazy things in his city-state. Like theoretical psionics taken to extremes. Anyhow, I figured he was a rather powerful psion or something, but his brilliance came at the expense of his sanity. Maybe he developed multiple personalities or something. And the dragon backed off because he was both thoroughly insane, maybe was the most powerful psion among the group, had an army of unfeeling wraiths who possessed fleshy vessels, and maybe some sort of green-age artifact that further bosted his psi. Daskinor's always been a favorite of mine, along with his crazy city-state. There's just gotta be something special about him. nick
#8 jaanos May 04, 2004 4:09:11	I like this. I always thought that an insane Psion has access to more Power, due to his insantity... and can attempt things beyond normal psionic minds. I think it's a theory worth exploring: * The dragon stays the heck away from him * Oronis occasionally thinks of how to relieve him from his 'pain' Keep in mind an Avingon would try to HEAL rather than HURT (like a dragon would) so maybe that in it's self provides a hint... some thing about old Daskinor makes him strong enough to ward off the dragon, but intriuqes and Avignon enough that it considers trying to heal him.... another groovy plot line! Originally posted by Cap'n Nick I always figured that Daskinor, while not the strongest magic-user of the SKs, may well have been the most brilliant psion among them. From the wisdom of the drylanders bit on eldaarich, he has some crazy things in his city-state. Like theoretical psionics taken to extremes. Anyhow, I figured he was a rather powerful psion or something, but his brilliance came at the expense of his sanity. Maybe he developed multiple personalities or something. And the dragon backed off because he was both thoroughly insane, maybe was the most powerful psion among the group, had an army of unfeeling wraiths who possessed fleshy vessels, and maybe some sort of green-age artifact that further bosted his psi. Daskinor's always been a favorite of mine, along with his crazy city-state. There's just gotta be something special about him. nick
#9 zombiegleemax May 04, 2004 5:50:25	Maybe you can use the subpsionic stuff from the Mind's Eye chapter on wizards homepage. Daskinor and his psions are the only ones on Athas who use this method, that makes them different. Just an idea...
#10 zombiegleemax Oct 25, 2004 5:02:36	How about the simple fact that Daskinor challenged Borys? If Borys wasn't aware that he was crazy, then a simple bluff could well have succeeded. Borys knew that Daskinor alone was no match for him, and even if he and Keltis had teamed up (another possibility, explaining the relief of Kurn's part of the tribute), the odds were still in Borys' favour. So the dragon would have likely assumed that he had come across a Blue Age/Green Age/Extraplanar artefact of extraordinary power or something.
#11 Grummore Oct 25, 2004 8:28:14	Dakisnor was mad, he just could have told the dragon that he would burn down is city rather than giving a single life in a moment of crazyness. Dakisnor might fear that one of the prisoners would give away important things related to is city. Could be as simple as that.
#12 Pennarin Oct 25, 2004 14:18:19	After reading a few novels and other athasian flavor texts, you get the feel that even the SKs were afraid to challenge the Dragon, and everybody seems to think that there's no way to challenge him (except Sadira). Now that would make sense, since he's a full dragon, is more advanced than anyone else, and has really, really impressive ressources. And surely, some SKs must have learned that Daskinor had managed to stop the dragon. Why didn't they rebel as well then? I don't understand, Shei-Nad: why would the SKs want to rebel? They put Borys in power. He's not an experiment gone wrong, he's all their hopes come to life: a force able to keep Rajaat imprisonned. However, when Eldaarich, or rather Daskinor, ''rebelled'' against the Dragon, the Dragon didn't even try to fight him. Why? I'd lean towards Xlorep's lengthly geopolitical explanation and the craziness factor.
#13 zombiegleemax Oct 30, 2004 13:15:12	I don't understand, Shei-Nad: why would the SKs want to rebel? They put Borys in power. He's not an experiment gone wrong, he's all their hopes come to life: a force able to keep Rajaat imprisonned. Very good point. Even if Borys killed Daskinor (I think he probably could, though not without injury) what would be the point? The citizens of Eldaarich would probably implode without him, or scatter to the four winds. Either way, Borys loses his slaves, so why bother?
#14 zombiegleemax Nov 09, 2004 3:35:11	Greyorm's idea is still my fav. That Nibenay theorised the creation of the Hollow, but Draskinor implemented it as Rajaat's prison and that envisioning and created this void of nothingness is what started Drask on the road to madness. Further speculation on this would have the SKs giving Drask a hefty amount of respect for what he did (perhaps even knowing the consequences of his actions), Borys included. When Drask's madness became a bit too much and he 'rebelled', Borys allowed Eldaarich to seclude itself, paying back a debt once owed. Should Drask have actually challenged Borys, I think the ol dragon would have said screw the debt of gratitude and sacked the whole city. Intead, he simply left it along. With Eldaarich, the main crossroad to the city of Kurn, effectively sealed off, Kurn may have been written off by default before Keltis had even begun his new transformation (though my dates may be off officially). For more on this, just do a search of Greyorm's posts.