3.5-ing a 2nd ed adventure? - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

3.5-ing a 2nd ed adventure?

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
uratoh
May 22, 2004 18:34:00 I got the Eternal Boundary and was wondering if any of you people have tips for 3.5-ifying it...mainly NPC stats obviously. ive never played 2nd ed (shame on me...), but I do at the very base understand AC being inverted....I dont know how to convert THAC0 though, and also, simple q:

What's the difference between a Prime and Planar in game terms? Does it just mean they're more 'plane-savvy' or?
#2
sildatorak
May 23, 2004 23:26:50 I can't give you specific advice on the NPC's involved, but here is some general advice on NPC conversions.

THAC0 is very similar to BAB, but the rates of change are different in 3e (in 2e rogues improved at 1/2, priests at 2/3, and wizards at 1/3). AC is inverted, but there will be slight inconsistencies as well, since bonuses for ability scores didn't work quite the same and there weren't dexterity bonus caps for different sorts of armor.

Your best bet is to just build a new NPC using the levels and equipment of the original as a guide. Don't be afraid to add a level or two of another class for humans, either. 2e multiclassing for humans was pretty tough, so if it seems like a somewhat shady fighter could benefit from a level or two of rogue, give it to her.

Demihumans are the opposite, their multiclassing was much easier in 2e (they went up simultaneously in two or three classes, though at a slightly slowed rate and only received half or one-third hp for each class). For them you will need to decide which is their main class and give them most of their levels there with some support in the other.
#3
uratoh
May 24, 2004 2:22:31 ah, k. and what about the Prime/Planar designation?
#4
zombiegleemax
Jun 01, 2004 15:50:42 Primes could not naturally sense portals while planars could, something like the elf ability to detect secret doors. Planars also had a sometimes funny disadvantage that they could be effected by summoning spells. They would just be walking along and suddenly a crystal would fly up to them and "zap" they were then standing there while a prime wizard yells "Just don't stand there, go attack that dragon!" I would ignore all that for 3.5, just keep the ability for planars to sense portals.
#5
uratoh
Jun 01, 2004 18:52:51 Is it something you can acquire, or just an inborn thing?
#6
zombiegleemax
Jun 02, 2004 9:59:51 Inborn. The major difference between primes and planars: Primes were born on the Prime Material Plane, Planars were not.
#7
sildatorak
Jun 02, 2004 20:19:44 Something that was quite often overlooked for convenience was that planars could not be affected by cure wounds spells (or cause wounds) when they were off of their home plane in 2e, but that would be gone in 3e.
#8
primemover003
Jun 02, 2004 21:23:45 That's not true Sildatorak... if a planar PC wasn't affected by a CLW then they wouldn't be feasible characters...

The only real differences between Planars and Primes were their susceptibility to Summoning, dismissals, banishments, protection from X spells, the ability to sense portals (as secret doors), and the fact that all Planars began choosing a faction.

Basically what the extraplanar subtype stands for now.
The differences in 3.5 is mainly the extraplanar subtype. Just convert them as normal. Forget the planar/prime tags...

Most if not all the Illuminated will be primes. Most of the bashers in Sigil are planars... the only thing you need to worry about is how spells work against people on the planes you're in. Basically the Outlands or the plane of Fire.
#9
sildatorak
Jun 03, 2004 15:48:08
Originally posted by primemover003
That's not true Sildatorak... if a planar PC wasn't affected by a CLW then they wouldn't be feasible characters...

AD&D 2nd edition PHB, pg. 253
"This healing cannot affect creatures without corporeal bodies, nor can it cure wounds of creatures not living or of extraplanar origin."

If they aren't on their homeplane, planars are considered extraplanar. Makes a trip to the Abyss an extremely dangerous undertaking. Fortunately that is all gone in 3e.
#10
zombiegleemax
Jun 09, 2004 20:09:26 I did both Harbinger House and Dead Gods in a 3e campaign, and I tell you, it's a task.

I had the advantage of a few years of 2e under my belt when I did it. I find that modules take just as long to prepare as making my own adventures, for various reasons, and thats if I don't have to do any of the monster/npc generation legwork. When I was running the old planescape modules, I was working double, in both learning the module and doing constant rule/npc/monster conversion work.

Don't let that discourage you, however. I found the planescape material to be some of the most interesting and rewarding material I've ever run, and for me the time was well worth it and I'm forever an old-school Planescape convert (I found the beginnings of my love in Torment, greatest PC game... EVER).

Doing the conversions also really helped with something I've had a hell of a problem with: I love 3e rules, but absolutely despise the feel of the books (the art, the descriptions, the equipment lists, spell names, ect). Running the old modules really helped me understand how to incorporate the old "feel" of the game with the new rules.

Anyway, that's my 2c. I know I didn't directly address your questions, but those seem to have been well fielded already. I just wanted to add my bit of experience doing almost the same thing.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 uratoh May 22, 2004 18:34:00	I got the Eternal Boundary and was wondering if any of you people have tips for 3.5-ifying it...mainly NPC stats obviously. ive never played 2nd ed (shame on me...), but I do at the very base understand AC being inverted....I dont know how to convert THAC0 though, and also, simple q: What's the difference between a Prime and Planar in game terms? Does it just mean they're more 'plane-savvy' or?
#2 sildatorak May 23, 2004 23:26:50	I can't give you specific advice on the NPC's involved, but here is some general advice on NPC conversions. THAC0 is very similar to BAB, but the rates of change are different in 3e (in 2e rogues improved at 1/2, priests at 2/3, and wizards at 1/3). AC is inverted, but there will be slight inconsistencies as well, since bonuses for ability scores didn't work quite the same and there weren't dexterity bonus caps for different sorts of armor. Your best bet is to just build a new NPC using the levels and equipment of the original as a guide. Don't be afraid to add a level or two of another class for humans, either. 2e multiclassing for humans was pretty tough, so if it seems like a somewhat shady fighter could benefit from a level or two of rogue, give it to her. Demihumans are the opposite, their multiclassing was much easier in 2e (they went up simultaneously in two or three classes, though at a slightly slowed rate and only received half or one-third hp for each class). For them you will need to decide which is their main class and give them most of their levels there with some support in the other.
#3 uratoh May 24, 2004 2:22:31	ah, k. and what about the Prime/Planar designation?
#4 zombiegleemax Jun 01, 2004 15:50:42	Primes could not naturally sense portals while planars could, something like the elf ability to detect secret doors. Planars also had a sometimes funny disadvantage that they could be effected by summoning spells. They would just be walking along and suddenly a crystal would fly up to them and "zap" they were then standing there while a prime wizard yells "Just don't stand there, go attack that dragon!" I would ignore all that for 3.5, just keep the ability for planars to sense portals.
#5 uratoh Jun 01, 2004 18:52:51	Is it something you can acquire, or just an inborn thing?
#6 zombiegleemax Jun 02, 2004 9:59:51	Inborn. The major difference between primes and planars: Primes were born on the Prime Material Plane, Planars were not.
#7 sildatorak Jun 02, 2004 20:19:44	Something that was quite often overlooked for convenience was that planars could not be affected by cure wounds spells (or cause wounds) when they were off of their home plane in 2e, but that would be gone in 3e.
#8 primemover003 Jun 02, 2004 21:23:45	That's not true Sildatorak... if a planar PC wasn't affected by a CLW then they wouldn't be feasible characters... The only real differences between Planars and Primes were their susceptibility to Summoning, dismissals, banishments, protection from X spells, the ability to sense portals (as secret doors), and the fact that all Planars began choosing a faction. Basically what the extraplanar subtype stands for now. The differences in 3.5 is mainly the extraplanar subtype. Just convert them as normal. Forget the planar/prime tags... Most if not all the Illuminated will be primes. Most of the bashers in Sigil are planars... the only thing you need to worry about is how spells work against people on the planes you're in. Basically the Outlands or the plane of Fire.
#9 sildatorak Jun 03, 2004 15:48:08	Originally posted by primemover003 That's not true Sildatorak... if a planar PC wasn't affected by a CLW then they wouldn't be feasible characters... AD&D 2nd edition PHB, pg. 253 "This healing cannot affect creatures without corporeal bodies, nor can it cure wounds of creatures not living or of extraplanar origin." If they aren't on their homeplane, planars are considered extraplanar. Makes a trip to the Abyss an extremely dangerous undertaking. Fortunately that is all gone in 3e.
#10 zombiegleemax Jun 09, 2004 20:09:26	I did both Harbinger House and Dead Gods in a 3e campaign, and I tell you, it's a task. I had the advantage of a few years of 2e under my belt when I did it. I find that modules take just as long to prepare as making my own adventures, for various reasons, and thats if I don't have to do any of the monster/npc generation legwork. When I was running the old planescape modules, I was working double, in both learning the module and doing constant rule/npc/monster conversion work. Don't let that discourage you, however. I found the planescape material to be some of the most interesting and rewarding material I've ever run, and for me the time was well worth it and I'm forever an old-school Planescape convert (I found the beginnings of my love in Torment, greatest PC game... EVER). Doing the conversions also really helped with something I've had a hell of a problem with: I love 3e rules, but absolutely despise the feel of the books (the art, the descriptions, the equipment lists, spell names, ect). Running the old modules really helped me understand how to incorporate the old "feel" of the game with the new rules. Anyway, that's my 2c. I know I didn't directly address your questions, but those seem to have been well fielded already. I just wanted to add my bit of experience doing almost the same thing.