Orcs of Thar too silly! - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

Orcs of Thar too silly!

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
spellweaver
May 27, 2004 8:33:38 I never liked Gaz 10, the Orcs of Thar. It's just too silly. I can see that it can provide a lot of fun if you enjoy playing humanoid races but it hasn't contributed anything at all to my campaign in which the humanoids are the baddies.

First of all, I cannot suspend my disbelief when I read about Atruaghin style Indian orcs, Sindi Ogres, Ethengar style hobgoblins and Ylari style gnolls. Too many cultures mixed in one place. And in my humble opinion the humanoids should develop their OWN culture. Sure enough, the gaz mentions a few cool details about their tribal life and faiths and rituals but IMO it is drowned in all the silly illustrations and stupid attempts (no offence Bruce!) at creating recognition, such as Trollhattan (Manhattan )

Second of all, what's up with Thar?? He is supposed to be this awesome orc warrior who united the Broken Lands and made civilizations all around tremble in fear. Instead he is under the heavy influence of Prince Jaggar (who's supposed to be Lawful even though he uses these dirty tricks), he could be under the control of Morphail as well, being a nosferatu, and finally he is a slave to his own sword the minute he gets a scratch!!

I would like to see a really cool new write-up of Thar and his rule over the Broken Lands. One that portrays the bloodthirsty humanoids as their own culture - savage, dark, chaotic.
I would like to see a write-up of the Legion's hordes of cruel warriors, their dreaded warmachines and their proud wolfriders.
I would like to see Thar as the menace to the Known World that he ought to be. One that requires ever watching unless his chaotic armies spill over into the civilized world.

Before I take on the challenge myself, has anyone ever done anything similar in their campaigns?

:-) Jesper
#2
Goldrak
May 27, 2004 9:10:22 Gaz 10 is one of my favorites (after the shadow elves one).
I simply can't see how it can be considered silly. It has helped to carve and make the broken lands a beliveble place and not just a "local with lots of humanoids".
As for a mixture of styles blame the Known World. The "cultures" depicted there represent the "cultures" from where that humanoids came, so blame the creator's of the Known World for putting such a variety of cultures in a space of the size of Europe...

Thar is a major villan and a powerful one in my campaings. Being a nosferatu only makes him more threatning and powerful. As i see him is as a ruthless, bloody and inteligent leader and not submissed to any mortal.

Perhaps he is on his journey to immortality?
;)
#3
zombiegleemax
May 27, 2004 10:24:21 I've used Orcs of Thar more than any of the other Gaz's combined. It cannot be beat for making NPC monsters to put a little fear into the hears of the PC's. The detail on the rituals and religions is great. Sure the puns get pretty grating (King Kol? Puh-lease!) but I can leave most of that out. I also really like the Oenkmar setting.

R.A.
#4
katana_one
May 27, 2004 11:18:07 The DM's historical synopsis of the humanoid clans is very useful to me. I also like the descriptions of the different sub-species of each humanoid race. As a campaign background tool it is invaluable.

It's only silly when you run a humanoid campaign as depicted.

Disregard the parts you don't like, use what you do.
#5
zombiegleemax
May 30, 2004 1:54:41 I used to consider it silly too - although I liked it usually.
But then I reread the Oenkmar stuff - and that's serious, and truly inspiring. Work it out with Shadow Elves, and a dark Azcan past - Humanoids never seemed so dramatic.
#6
Midnight_v
Jun 09, 2008 8:07:56 Wow... I'd really like to see the Orcs of thar done seriously in later editons.
#7
havard
Jun 09, 2008 9:12:42
Wow... I'd really like to see the Orcs of thar done seriously in later editons.

Are you kidding? The Orcs of Thar is an awesome book! What I would like to see is a pdf of the current version available as _legal_ download.

Ofcourse, a more serious take on the Brokenlands of Mystara would also be interesting. While the chances of WotC doing Mystara are pretty slim, this seems like a good candidate for a new Fan Gazetteer.

Havard
#8
merrikcale
Jun 09, 2008 21:09:12 it was a bit silly, like many of the Gaz's but a lot of fun
#9
Cthulhudrew
Jun 10, 2008 2:10:03
... and stupid attempts (no offence Bruce!) at creating recognition, such as Trollhattan (Manhattan )

Actually, I believe he was going for something resembling the RW Trollhattan, considering the Northern Reaches origins of the Mystaran trolls.
#10
havard
Jun 10, 2008 7:20:59
Actually, I believe he was going for something resembling the RW Trollhattan, considering the Northern Reaches origins of the Mystaran trolls.

Yeah, Sweden's Trollhättan is probably where he got the name from, although the resemblance to Manhattan probably wasn't entirely unintentional either.

Interesting fact from the wikipedia link you provided:
The name "Trollhättan" comes from folkloristic tales. People believed that large trolls lived in the river Göta älv and that the islands in the river were the Trolls' hoods ("hättor"). Other former names of the site is Eiðar and Stora Edet; the latter lives on in the name of the south-bordering municipality of Lilla Edet. The waterfall of Trollhättan has been theorized to be the Mímir's Well from the Norse mythology.

Maybe the Mimir's Well concept can be used in the Brokenlands somehow?

Havard
#11
Hugin
Jun 10, 2008 8:21:09 That's really interesting info. I kinda makes me look at Trollhattan in a different light.
#12
Midnight_v
Jun 10, 2008 9:01:51 No I'm serious, do a darker more realistic 3.5 or 4.0 orcs of thar book.
Thought that might seem too much like wow...
Actually I'd always thought thats were Wow got thier idea from...
*shrug*
FTH and all that nonsense..

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 spellweaver May 27, 2004 8:33:38	I never liked Gaz 10, the Orcs of Thar. It's just too silly. I can see that it can provide a lot of fun if you enjoy playing humanoid races but it hasn't contributed anything at all to my campaign in which the humanoids are the baddies. First of all, I cannot suspend my disbelief when I read about Atruaghin style Indian orcs, Sindi Ogres, Ethengar style hobgoblins and Ylari style gnolls. Too many cultures mixed in one place. And in my humble opinion the humanoids should develop their OWN culture. Sure enough, the gaz mentions a few cool details about their tribal life and faiths and rituals but IMO it is drowned in all the silly illustrations and stupid attempts (no offence Bruce!) at creating recognition, such as Trollhattan (Manhattan ) Second of all, what's up with Thar?? He is supposed to be this awesome orc warrior who united the Broken Lands and made civilizations all around tremble in fear. Instead he is under the heavy influence of Prince Jaggar (who's supposed to be Lawful even though he uses these dirty tricks), he could be under the control of Morphail as well, being a nosferatu, and finally he is a slave to his own sword the minute he gets a scratch!! I would like to see a really cool new write-up of Thar and his rule over the Broken Lands. One that portrays the bloodthirsty humanoids as their own culture - savage, dark, chaotic. I would like to see a write-up of the Legion's hordes of cruel warriors, their dreaded warmachines and their proud wolfriders. I would like to see Thar as the menace to the Known World that he ought to be. One that requires ever watching unless his chaotic armies spill over into the civilized world. Before I take on the challenge myself, has anyone ever done anything similar in their campaigns? :-) Jesper
#2 Goldrak May 27, 2004 9:10:22	Gaz 10 is one of my favorites (after the shadow elves one). I simply can't see how it can be considered silly. It has helped to carve and make the broken lands a beliveble place and not just a "local with lots of humanoids". As for a mixture of styles blame the Known World. The "cultures" depicted there represent the "cultures" from where that humanoids came, so blame the creator's of the Known World for putting such a variety of cultures in a space of the size of Europe... Thar is a major villan and a powerful one in my campaings. Being a nosferatu only makes him more threatning and powerful. As i see him is as a ruthless, bloody and inteligent leader and not submissed to any mortal. Perhaps he is on his journey to immortality? ;)
#3 zombiegleemax May 27, 2004 10:24:21	I've used Orcs of Thar more than any of the other Gaz's combined. It cannot be beat for making NPC monsters to put a little fear into the hears of the PC's. The detail on the rituals and religions is great. Sure the puns get pretty grating (King Kol? Puh-lease!) but I can leave most of that out. I also really like the Oenkmar setting. R.A.
#4 katana_one May 27, 2004 11:18:07	The DM's historical synopsis of the humanoid clans is very useful to me. I also like the descriptions of the different sub-species of each humanoid race. As a campaign background tool it is invaluable. It's only silly when you run a humanoid campaign as depicted. Disregard the parts you don't like, use what you do.
#5 zombiegleemax May 30, 2004 1:54:41	I used to consider it silly too - although I liked it usually. But then I reread the Oenkmar stuff - and that's serious, and truly inspiring. Work it out with Shadow Elves, and a dark Azcan past - Humanoids never seemed so dramatic.
#6 Midnight_v Jun 09, 2008 8:07:56	Wow... I'd really like to see the Orcs of thar done seriously in later editons.
#7 havard Jun 09, 2008 9:12:42	Wow... I'd really like to see the Orcs of thar done seriously in later editons. Are you kidding? The Orcs of Thar is an awesome book! What I would like to see is a pdf of the current version available as _legal_ download. Ofcourse, a more serious take on the Brokenlands of Mystara would also be interesting. While the chances of WotC doing Mystara are pretty slim, this seems like a good candidate for a new Fan Gazetteer. Havard
#8 merrikcale Jun 09, 2008 21:09:12	it was a bit silly, like many of the Gaz's but a lot of fun
#9 Cthulhudrew Jun 10, 2008 2:10:03	... and stupid attempts (no offence Bruce!) at creating recognition, such as Trollhattan (Manhattan ) Actually, I believe he was going for something resembling the RW Trollhattan, considering the Northern Reaches origins of the Mystaran trolls.
#10 havard Jun 10, 2008 7:20:59	Actually, I believe he was going for something resembling the RW Trollhattan, considering the Northern Reaches origins of the Mystaran trolls. Yeah, Sweden's Trollhättan is probably where he got the name from, although the resemblance to Manhattan probably wasn't entirely unintentional either. Interesting fact from the wikipedia link you provided: The name "Trollhättan" comes from folkloristic tales. People believed that large trolls lived in the river Göta älv and that the islands in the river were the Trolls' hoods ("hättor"). Other former names of the site is Eiðar and Stora Edet; the latter lives on in the name of the south-bordering municipality of Lilla Edet. The waterfall of Trollhättan has been theorized to be the Mímir's Well from the Norse mythology. Maybe the Mimir's Well concept can be used in the Brokenlands somehow? Havard
#11 Hugin Jun 10, 2008 8:21:09	That's really interesting info. I kinda makes me look at Trollhattan in a different light.
#12 Midnight_v Jun 10, 2008 9:01:51	No I'm serious, do a darker more realistic 3.5 or 4.0 orcs of thar book. Thought that might seem too much like wow... Actually I'd always thought thats were Wow got thier idea from... shrug FTH and all that nonsense..