I personally think the majority on these boards would like us to make as little change as possible to the original manuscript, but I would like to get your opinion on this. Do you want DA remodeled to fit the new 3E/3.5 adventure layout style, or would you prefer the original 2E style it is written in (sort of akin to Dragon's Crown and Black Spine)?
As I wouldn't be running it in (A)D&D anyway, I care not for the format!
(As an aside, what are the major differences in the two formats?)
Sorry, I prefer function over form in my adventures, nostalgia be damned. Pick a layout style that fits best with the adventure itself.
I think you should go with the 2e format. Any DM worth his salt should be able to taylor the adventure as he sees fit for his campaign.
I'd use Dungeon magazine adventures as a model, with all the various DC's, lighting, and other important crunchy bits in a header at the start of any specific location or encounter. I'd also break background information into a seperate and individual section for each "chapter", so that the DM doesn't have to hunt for it in small sections.
Adamantyr
In case this doesn't interfere I choose the most 'beautiful' one..
Originally posted by Kamelion
I would suggest that the layout conform to the style of previous Dark Sun releases. That approach was comprehensive and detailed, yet manageable and easy to navigate. Aesthetically speaking it's also nice to have a continuity of style.
Agreed.
Originally posted by Sysane
I think you should go with the 2e format. Any DM worth his salt should be able to taylor the adventure as he sees fit for his campaign.
I think you should go with the original version in russian. Any DM worth his salt should be able to translate it anyway.
(Sorry Sysane
, but I don't like that argument at all, a variation on the No True Scotsman... fallacy, stating that only incompetent DMs should want to get the 3E version handed down to them.)I like the 3E layout in the adventures I've read, the most proeminent in my memory being City of the Spider Queen. More than liking it, I do think the layout was more game-friendly than for most 2E adventures, which I sometimes found confusing to walk through. I specifically hated encounters or new bits of sections that began with historical ramblimgs or character development, forcing you to fast forward down the paragraphs in search of what the players' situation is in that section and what you should prepare for.
Originally posted by Pennarin
I specifically hated encounters or new bits of sections that began with historical ramblimgs or character development, forcing you to fast forward down the paragraphs in search of what the players' situation is in that section and what you should prepare for.
I agree with pennarim...
Oh, and one thing. I understand the arguement about changing as little as possible about the adventure, but please, please, please . . . if something in the adventure is simply too lame, rediculous, or even worse, creates more continuity errors than we already have, by any and all means change it. If something could use a little touch of fleshing out for background or flavor, add it in. Its easy enough in a pdf to add sidebars and annotations about alterations made to the doc for those who want to see it as it was originally intended. We've waited for so long on it, and will likely be waiting for some time longer. Make it worth the wait. Which I'm sure you can anyhow.
LOL!!!!1!!1
Originally posted by Dawnstealer
I recommend introducing space halflings. They're @w3so|\/|3.
LOL!!!!1!!1
Yep, Dregoth will have his hands full with them.
One quick bathroom break from that space hamster and he's going to have a halfling battlecruiser crushing him...
Originally posted by Mach2.5
Oh, and one thing. I understand the arguement about changing as little as possible about the adventure, but please, please, please . . . if something in the adventure is simply too lame, rediculous, or even worse, creates more continuity errors than we already have, by any and all means change it. If something could use a little touch of fleshing out for background or flavor, add it in. Its easy enough in a pdf to add sidebars and annotations about alterations made to the doc for those who want to see it as it was originally intended. We've waited for so long on it, and will likely be waiting for some time longer. Make it worth the wait. Which I'm sure you can anyhow.
Additions are cool, but cutting material out... the problem is you'll have guys who want the "original uncut material" because they disagree with some aspect of the adventure.
If it's original work done by Athas.org, then by all means only release what you want, but if it was a prior product of TSR that never saw the light, it may be better to avoid some conflict by having the original documents available for consideration. If it's possible to do so, of course.
Adamantyr
but.. DO IT NOW!! Or I'll summon a fleet of whistlers space hamsters to pester you...
I like the 3E layout in the adventures I've read, the most proeminent in my memory being City of the Spider Queen. More than liking it, I do think the layout was more game-friendly than for most 2E adventures, which I sometimes found confusing to walk through.
Two words. "Hi-Liter" ;)
I also have to agree with Dawn on that it really doesn't matter what format its released in. Just so long as its out. I seriously don't want to wait another minute for DA especially over something as trivial as format.
Originally posted by Adamantyr
Additions are cool, but cutting material out... the problem is it may be better to avoid some conflict by having the original documents available for consideration. If it's possible to do so, of course.
If we could do that, it would have been released by now. ;)
Originally posted by Adamantyr
Additions are cool, but cutting material out... the problem is you'll have guys who want the "original uncut material" because they disagree with some aspect of the adventure.
Here's an extract of Veiled Alliance that, if ever the product had been republished in 3E, should have been cut. The passage is refering to Siemhouk:
«He taught her magic and psionics, as much as she could handle, then protected her has she fought enemies and gained experience.»
If that is not a blatant artifact of 2E game mechanics that has no place in 3E products...
I have used 2e and 3e adventures and even adapted them to other systems, so the format really doesn't matter if the "fluff" stays intact.
Originally posted by Adamantyr
Additions are cool, but cutting material out... the problem is you'll have guys who want the "original uncut material" because they disagree with some aspect of the adventure.
If it's original work done by Athas.org, then by all means only release what you want, but if it was a prior product of TSR that never saw the light, it may be better to avoid some conflict by having the original documents available for consideration. If it's possible to do so, of course.
Adamantyr
Dregoth Ascending was the last product written for the Dark Sun line under the TSR banner. It was never published because the line was terminiated only days after the first (unedited, unplaytested) draft of the product was completed. It was supposed to be a 128-page adventure box set with a 32-page monster and map booklet. Included within this product was the Timeline of Athas, which was released to the Internet community (with TSR permission) by the author (Kevin Melka, who now works with Bastion Press) prior to the public announcement that Dark Sun was being cancelled.
If I remember correctly, Athas.org received a copy of it the manuscript later from WoTC staff with permission to either post it as 2E or convert (later) to 3E. That was several years ago.
Having seen the full manuscript, it could very easily be run as is for 2nd Edition (with DM tweaks for balance and such), but 3E would definately require work given the new rules. IMHO, the overall plotline (which I won't devulge) is the most difficult to integrate into a campaign, since it involves the city of Draj and other plot elements that were supposed to pick up the DS storyline as it stood 9 year ago. Not an impossible task for a creative DM, but could pose a plot problem if someone has advanced their campaign quite a bit since then, especially within the city of Draj.
AnOldGamer
Originally posted by Dawnstealer
Now I'm really curious. As far as monsters and maps go, I'm up for art, if necessary. Of course, I'll be moving shortly, but once that's done and over with, I'll get back to busting out critter drawings.
The bad news (sorry) is that the maps are probably a gonner. The reason for this is the program they were drawn in was some old version of Clarisworks for the MAC (which is what TSR was using back then .. ick!), and from what I heard were pretty rough to begin with and never drawn by hand. If the Athas.org team has these files, then it is up to them to try and translate them. When last I spoke with Kevin, he said he did not have these files, only his original manuscripts; but he did say that if you read the text close enough you could probably come up with them on your own.
In the old TSR days, maps with turnovers were apparently very rough. After a map was assigned to a cartographer (like Diesel) he and the designer+editor would sit down and go over it in more detail. In the end you would have a completed map, but up until that point you usually had nothing more than a scribbled idea.
AnOldGamer
Originally posted by AnOldGamer
The bad news (sorry) is that the maps are probably a gonner. The reason for this is the program they were drawn in was some old version of Clarisworks for the MAC (which is what TSR was using back then .. ick!), and from what I heard were pretty rough to begin with and never drawn by hand. If the Athas.org team has these files, then it is up to them to try and translate them.
Yeah, got a copy of the maps myself, along with most others at Athas.org, and they are indeed, very rough.
They give a good idea of what was going to be mapped out though. Hopefully we can get a few of the mappers on the boards and such to help us out in that department.
Originally posted by NytCrawlr
Yeah, got a copy of the maps myself, along with most others at Athas.org, and they are indeed, very rough.
They give a good idea of what was going to be mapped out though. Hopefully we can get a few of the mappers on the boards and such to help us out in that department.
*cough*cyrus9a*cough*
Originally posted by xlorepdarkhelm
*cough*cyrus9a*cough*
Exactly who I was thinking of.
:D
......must be some wierd virus going around...