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Immortals worshipped by demihumans?

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
spellweaver
Jul 03, 2004 11:43:23 I think it is a shame that there are so few demi-human immortals. I don't think that dwarves and elves would worship human immortals in general and that leaves them with (by my count):

Garal Glitterlode
Kagyar
Ilsundal
Mealiden
Eiryndul
Rafiel
Calitha Starbrow

Granted, there are many immortals related to nature, forests and the fey races, which elves might also worship but I really miss more immortals for the dwarves. An immortal patron of war, one of kings, one of craftsmanship, one of trade etc.

What do you do in your campaigns?

:-) Jesper
#2
stanles
Jul 03, 2004 18:07:57
Originally posted by Spellweaver
I think it is a shame that there are so few demi-human immortals. I don't think that dwarves and elves would worship human immortals in general and that leaves them with (by my count):

Garal Glitterlode
Kagyar
Ilsundal
Mealiden
Eiryndul
Rafiel
Calitha Starbrow

Granted, there are many immortals related to nature, forests and the fey races, which elves might also worship but I really miss more immortals for the dwarves. An immortal patron of war, one of kings, one of craftsmanship, one of trade etc.

What do you do in your campaigns?

:-) Jesper

There's nothing stopping human immortals taking on demi-human forms and being worshipped within those forms in demi-human communities. An example of this style of thign is Korotiku taking on the guise of Saimpt Renard in the Renardy pantheon. It specifically points out that he does so in the guise of a lupin and that the locals would be loathe to believe otherwise.
#3
Cthulhudrew
Jul 03, 2004 21:17:39
Originally posted by Spellweaver
Granted, there are many immortals related to nature, forests and the fey races, which elves might also worship but I really miss more immortals for the dwarves. An immortal patron of war, one of kings, one of craftsmanship, one of trade etc.

A good point. They do seem a bit "Immortal" lite.

Some Immortals that would be likely to be worshipped by the demihumans from canon sources:

The High Heroes (Halfling Pantheon)- from Gaz8- which includes:
Brindorhin
Nob Nar
Coberham Shadowglint

Also, Usamigaras is noted in WotI as originally being a halfling, so he might still sponsor hin in Mystara. You could probably add to the High Heroes list very easily with other "notable" halfling immortals (mostly from the Age of Heroes or earlier).

The Korrigans (from the Master DM's Book, Artifacts section). Some sources have these 9 elves as a group separate from the other elvish Immortals, though I've taken a different tact and had this simply be the name for the elvish pantheon, consisting of:
Ilsundal
Eiryndul
Mealiden
Calitha Starbrow
Aeryl (first of the winged elves)
Ardashiye (first king of Shiye-Lawr)
Terra (original elvish Immortal of Evergrun)
Enoreth (first king of the Geffronell elves of Denagoth)

Which leaves one unaccounted for elf in the Korrigan. I'm not totally sold on Terra being part of the pantheon either, which might leave two open spots for as yet unknown Immortals.

As for Dwarves, well, I can't really think offhand of any other dwarvish Immortals. Seems to me there were some- and certainly there should be some, if only as holdovers from the original 'Blackmoor' era dwarves.
#4
spellweaver
Jul 04, 2004 5:09:06
Originally posted by Cthulhudrew
Which leaves one unaccounted for elf in the Korrigan. I'm not totally sold on Terra being part of the pantheon either, which might leave two open spots for as yet unknown Immortals.

Isn't Ordanna the original creator of the elven race? I seem to recal reading somewhere in the Hollow World boxed set that she made them to guard her beloved forests?

:-) Jesper
#5
Cthulhudrew
Jul 04, 2004 5:14:41
Originally posted by Spellweaver
Isn't Ordanna the original creator of the elven race? I seem to recal reading somewhere in the Hollow World boxed set that she made them to guard her beloved forests?

That's who I meant- D'OH! I didn't think Terra sounded right...
#6
havard
Jul 04, 2004 8:36:31 The Terra mix-up probably comes from the Drgonlord Trilogy which had the elves (and Gold Dragons) be clercs of Terra, and IIRC claiming her to be their creator.

IMC, I had the elves worship both Ordana and Terra, but as opposed to ancient times, these are now considered lesser immortals of the pantheon.

It is also debatable whether Callarii, the grieving elf maiden patroness of the Callarii Elves should be considered an immortal.

I included Usamigaras "Samie Garas" to the Hin pantheon, aswell as other immortals connected with nature. The Hin are being described in the Five Shires gaz as relatively uninterested in Immortals, but since I decided to make the Hin Masters powerful Druids, it made sense to bring those other nature immortals in as well.

IMC, I decided that the Dwarves and Gnomes would have more or less the same pantheon:
Kagyar
Garel
Karr (Thanatos)
Terra (Probably under some other name)

Shadow elf Pantheon:
Rafiel
Atzanteotl
#7
zombiegleemax
Jul 07, 2004 9:48:36 Personally I'm not sold out to the association between the Korrigans and the "known" elven immortals.

First of all, WotI (only official source for the Korrigans's background besides old Master set) says the Korrigans quested together to become immortals, so this is plainly in contrast with each immortal's background.

Second of all, Aeryl never attained immortality (she isn't listed in Savage Coast or Red Steel's list of ee'aar's immortals), Ardashiye is completely non-canon (Eiryndul being the one and only immortal ever listed for Shiye and Alphatian elves), and Enoreth is similarly never mentioned as having been an immortal elf (it only comes from a map in X11, where Enoreth Shrine is listed as "important spot" in the Great Forest of Geffron).

Thereby (to make a long story short) I go with the idea the 9 Korrigans really attained immortality together, by protecting Wendar from the aftereffects of the GRoF (imbuing the land with magical power and arcane wards and thus making it unique, and creating the Elvenstar, capable of channelling the power of the land through its magic nodes).

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 spellweaver Jul 03, 2004 11:43:23	I think it is a shame that there are so few demi-human immortals. I don't think that dwarves and elves would worship human immortals in general and that leaves them with (by my count): Garal Glitterlode Kagyar Ilsundal Mealiden Eiryndul Rafiel Calitha Starbrow Granted, there are many immortals related to nature, forests and the fey races, which elves might also worship but I really miss more immortals for the dwarves. An immortal patron of war, one of kings, one of craftsmanship, one of trade etc. What do you do in your campaigns? :-) Jesper
#2 stanles Jul 03, 2004 18:07:57	Originally posted by Spellweaver I think it is a shame that there are so few demi-human immortals. I don't think that dwarves and elves would worship human immortals in general and that leaves them with (by my count): Garal Glitterlode Kagyar Ilsundal Mealiden Eiryndul Rafiel Calitha Starbrow Granted, there are many immortals related to nature, forests and the fey races, which elves might also worship but I really miss more immortals for the dwarves. An immortal patron of war, one of kings, one of craftsmanship, one of trade etc. What do you do in your campaigns? :-) Jesper There's nothing stopping human immortals taking on demi-human forms and being worshipped within those forms in demi-human communities. An example of this style of thign is Korotiku taking on the guise of Saimpt Renard in the Renardy pantheon. It specifically points out that he does so in the guise of a lupin and that the locals would be loathe to believe otherwise.
#3 Cthulhudrew Jul 03, 2004 21:17:39	Originally posted by Spellweaver Granted, there are many immortals related to nature, forests and the fey races, which elves might also worship but I really miss more immortals for the dwarves. An immortal patron of war, one of kings, one of craftsmanship, one of trade etc. A good point. They do seem a bit "Immortal" lite. Some Immortals that would be likely to be worshipped by the demihumans from canon sources: The High Heroes (Halfling Pantheon)- from Gaz8- which includes: Brindorhin Nob Nar Coberham Shadowglint Also, Usamigaras is noted in WotI as originally being a halfling, so he might still sponsor hin in Mystara. You could probably add to the High Heroes list very easily with other "notable" halfling immortals (mostly from the Age of Heroes or earlier). The Korrigans (from the Master DM's Book, Artifacts section). Some sources have these 9 elves as a group separate from the other elvish Immortals, though I've taken a different tact and had this simply be the name for the elvish pantheon, consisting of: Ilsundal Eiryndul Mealiden Calitha Starbrow Aeryl (first of the winged elves) Ardashiye (first king of Shiye-Lawr) Terra (original elvish Immortal of Evergrun) Enoreth (first king of the Geffronell elves of Denagoth) Which leaves one unaccounted for elf in the Korrigan. I'm not totally sold on Terra being part of the pantheon either, which might leave two open spots for as yet unknown Immortals. As for Dwarves, well, I can't really think offhand of any other dwarvish Immortals. Seems to me there were some- and certainly there should be some, if only as holdovers from the original 'Blackmoor' era dwarves.
#4 spellweaver Jul 04, 2004 5:09:06	Originally posted by Cthulhudrew Which leaves one unaccounted for elf in the Korrigan. I'm not totally sold on Terra being part of the pantheon either, which might leave two open spots for as yet unknown Immortals. Isn't Ordanna the original creator of the elven race? I seem to recal reading somewhere in the Hollow World boxed set that she made them to guard her beloved forests? :-) Jesper
#5 Cthulhudrew Jul 04, 2004 5:14:41	Originally posted by Spellweaver Isn't Ordanna the original creator of the elven race? I seem to recal reading somewhere in the Hollow World boxed set that she made them to guard her beloved forests? That's who I meant- D'OH! I didn't think Terra sounded right...
#6 havard Jul 04, 2004 8:36:31	The Terra mix-up probably comes from the Drgonlord Trilogy which had the elves (and Gold Dragons) be clercs of Terra, and IIRC claiming her to be their creator. IMC, I had the elves worship both Ordana and Terra, but as opposed to ancient times, these are now considered lesser immortals of the pantheon. It is also debatable whether Callarii, the grieving elf maiden patroness of the Callarii Elves should be considered an immortal. I included Usamigaras "Samie Garas" to the Hin pantheon, aswell as other immortals connected with nature. The Hin are being described in the Five Shires gaz as relatively uninterested in Immortals, but since I decided to make the Hin Masters powerful Druids, it made sense to bring those other nature immortals in as well. IMC, I decided that the Dwarves and Gnomes would have more or less the same pantheon: Kagyar Garel Karr (Thanatos) Terra (Probably under some other name) Shadow elf Pantheon: Rafiel Atzanteotl
#7 zombiegleemax Jul 07, 2004 9:48:36	Personally I'm not sold out to the association between the Korrigans and the "known" elven immortals. First of all, WotI (only official source for the Korrigans's background besides old Master set) says the Korrigans quested together to become immortals, so this is plainly in contrast with each immortal's background. Second of all, Aeryl never attained immortality (she isn't listed in Savage Coast or Red Steel's list of ee'aar's immortals), Ardashiye is completely non-canon (Eiryndul being the one and only immortal ever listed for Shiye and Alphatian elves), and Enoreth is similarly never mentioned as having been an immortal elf (it only comes from a map in X11, where Enoreth Shrine is listed as "important spot" in the Great Forest of Geffron). Thereby (to make a long story short) I go with the idea the 9 Korrigans really attained immortality together, by protecting Wendar from the aftereffects of the GRoF (imbuing the land with magical power and arcane wards and thus making it unique, and creating the Elvenstar, capable of channelling the power of the land through its magic nodes).