Antigenesis: If genesis is manifested on the Material Plane, the power takes effect and the demiplane begins to grow at the rate noted above, but it gets no larger than a radius of 1 foot per level. The energies of the new plane are exactly canceled by the energies of the original plane, creating a dead spot like a limited cancer on the original plane. The expanding boundary of the dead spot wipes away all construction, crumbles natural land forms, and evaporates water, leaving behind a uniformly level area of inert dust. Living creatures that pass the boundary of the growing dead spot are not directly affected, but plants can find no sustenance in the dust of the dead spot, water-breathing creatures die quickly when water turns to dust, and mobile animals know enough to leave the area alone. Once the wave of change passes, no special essence remains in the dead spot, and it may be colonized naturally over the course of several years by bacteria, plants, and animals.
I've been reading all the powers in expanded psioncis to try and get more familiar with them. I came across Genesis. If the power is used on the prime material plane, then antigenesis occues.
I just thought that was a fairly good description of silt....
Maybe someone (Sk) were trying to create their own realms with a high level of this, and that's why Athas is cut off, and that's why the silt is so prevelant. Just thinking...
Mephboy
Maybe the one who tried to create his '' pocket'' world succeeded but at the expanse of life-energy on Athas.
--like any other spell on Athas life-energy is consumed when the spell ''worked''. Imagine a spell of epic level capable of creating ''pocket worlds'': atrue defiler spell. Ironicaly, the spell would need to destroy for ''it'', to create.
Now, we know that the Hollow is only as large as the objects it contains (ie: Rajaat's "essence"), but it is also a non-space, a nothing without time or space. As such, it must be defined without boundaries and ends up "essentially" infinite. It might also be considered "functionally" infinite as well, being completely non-spatial (that is, how do you define the boundaries of nothing or no-space?).
Imagine the havoc this paradox would wreak regarding the Genesis power Mephboy references! Since the new plane has no set size, it could presumably fill an infinite size if enough material is imported into it. However, I note this particular problem is easily overcome by having the space devoured by the antigenesis grow in direct proportion to amount of material placed inside the created plane. The real problem is that the plane is a non-space and cannot have a size or be spatially bounded.
Imagine, momentarily, that this "infinite" property of the prison was discovered only after Rajaat was placed within the Hollow -- the Champions (wrongly) deducing that a non-space would consume no area. Thus they face a great wave of antigenesis spreading outwards without ceasure, consuming land and boiling away water*, reducing both to inert dust. What could the Champions do...except find some other method of satiating the prison's expanding hunger.
So we come to the seven-thousand(?) slaves of the levy. Somehow, the Champions have managed to alter the effects of the antigeneis so that instead of devouring space, it consumes these sacrifices over the course of a year, and its hunger is contained.
In fact, this may be the source of Dakinor's madness and worry...as I mentioned, that the "nothing is coming to get him"...that the antigenesis will escape one day and devour him. Or, what if he knows (or more likely believes) the antigenesis effect would stop if he were sacrificed to it, creating a psionic feedback loop, and fears the other Sorcerer Kings have "discovered" this as well and are simply biding their time, waiting to lure him into a trap and finalize the permanent imprisionment and destruction of the Warbringer.
The only specific logical problem I find against implementing this particular version of events regards the existance of the silt-dwelling creatures which (apparently) evolved to fill the niches left behind when the sea-dwelling creatures were destroyed or vanished or..? For this, I imagine there is some way in which to link the above theory with my musings (which I find I need to repost) about the Pristine Tower's hypertemporal effects and make it all work out.
(* I note this would match with the information Kamelion provided, about the Sunrise Sea boiling away. As to the formation of the Ring of Fire...if everything is reduced to a level plane of inert dust, the geological consequences of such sudden changes in the tectonic stresses of that particular location could cause a sudden upwelling of lava and mountain/volcano formation, crustal fracturing, earthquakes and etc.)
PS: If any of the bits about Daskinor and Rajaat's imprisionment confuse anyone, note that much of it is based on previous discussions in other threads about the history and cosmology of Athas.
PPS: Note my addendum to the material in the "What Happened to Athas' Oceans?" thread at the very bottom, regarding the timeline, which unfortunately makes most of the above theory impossible without changes to cannonical history.
"It is written in the Book of Urik that the Sea of
Silt was once an ocean of water called the Sunrise
Sea. In the middle of this fabled sea a great island
lay green and fair, in the days before the founding of
Urik. No one knows what happened, but some great
calamity overtook the green isle, for the Book
of Urik tells of the boiling of the Sunrise Sea and
the Rain of Ash over the seven cities."
-From the Scroll of Kelaimos, in the library of the Oba of Gulg
.Fascinating theory...let me take this even a little further. Supposing Daskinor utilized the Genesis power to create the Hollow within the Black when he and the Champions moved against and imprisioned Rajaat.
Interesting Theory, I am reading with great interest. Although, was it not Nibenay that created the hollow?
Of course, it's all moot given the timeline (sigh). Obviously, one could just ignore the existing timeline as "the lies of conquerors" and do whatever they want, but I'm less inclined towards that for various design reasons.
I think we discussed that Nibenay designed and researched the idea, being the master of the Black among the Champions, and Daskinor actually implemented it, being the most powerful psionicist among them./QUOTE]
This I don't get. Was Nibenay being a sage of the Black just speculated or is it written hardcore fact? Him being the "Shadow King" doen't necessarily mean he has ties to it.
This I don't get. Was Nibenay being a sage of the Black just speculated or is it written hardcore fact? Him being the "Shadow King" doen't necessarily mean he has ties to it.
AFAIK it's all speculation. I agree it doesn't necessarily mean what we've taken it to mean, but it works for the purposes it has been put to.
AFAIK it's all speculation. I agree it doesn't necessarily mean what we've taken it to mean, but it works for the purposes it has been put to.
Figured as much. I just take that the title of "Shadow King" reflects Nib's reclusive and espionage like nature than him being the master of the Black. However, if it suits this topics purpose by making him as such, embellish away! :D
Figured as much. I just take that the title of "Shadow King" reflects Nib's reclusive and espionage like nature than him being the master of the Black. However, if it suits this topics purpose by making him as such, embellish away! :D
I kinda like making him boh. Basically, in his persuits for being secretive, he researched into the Black in an effort to expand his power and provide a magical means to enhance that ability.
I kinda like making him boh. Basically, in his persuits for being secretive, he researched into the Black in an effort to expand his power and provide a magical means to enhance that ability.
IMO that would now be the province of Andropinis. Being locked in the Black (before his esacpe) for 10 years would twist him in some way. Thats what I ended up doing in my campaign anyhow.
IMO that would now be the province of Andropinis. Being locked in the Black (before his esacpe) for 10 years would twist him in some way. Thats what I ended up doing in my campaign anyhow.
There's a difference between being trapped in the Black, and having studied it extensively. I coulda sworn that there was somewhere which explained that Nib made the Hollow to put Rajaat in, from his knowledge of the Black.
There's a difference between being trapped in the Black, and having studied it extensively. I coulda sworn that there was somewhere which explained that Nib made the Hollow to put Rajaat in, from his knowledge of the Black.
True, but being trapped in there so long would give Andro alittle more "hands on and intimate" knowledge that Nib couldn't possibly understand or fathom.
I'm pretty sure the Nib/Black connection was just speculation from the fan base unless its from a source that wasn't released like DA or SoTDL.
True, but being trapped in there so long would give Andro alittle more "hands on and intimate" knowledge that Nib couldn't possibly understand or fathom.
Well, it depends. if Nib's been researching the Black for a few thousand years, one would think he'd be much more intimately knowledgeable about it than Andropinis who had only been there for 10 years, and imprisoned on top of that.
I'm pretty sure the Nib/Black connection was just speculation from the fan base unless its from a source that wasn't released like DA or SoTDL.
I honestly don't remember.
Well, it depends. if Nib's been researching the Black for a few thousand years, one would think he'd be much more intimately knowledgeable about it than Andropinis who had only been there for 10 years, and imprisoned on top of that.
True again, but I think Nib's resources and efforts were either focused on his task of exterminating the gnomes or not succumbing to the bestial rage in the next step of his metamorphosis.
True again, but I think Nib's resources and efforts were either focused on his task of exterminating the gnomes or not succumbing to the bestial rage in the next step of his metamorphosis.
Well, there was a rather large period, if I remember correctly, where he had already exterminated the Gnomes, and before Borys initiated the Dragon metamorphosis.
I coulda sworn that there was somewhere which explained that Nib made the Hollow to put Rajaat in, from his knowledge of the Black.
Part of it is RaFoaDK (the part where Nib explains the Hollow after Rajaat's murder), the rest is fan-based.
Well, there was a rather large period, if I remember correctly, where he had already exterminated the Gnomes, and before Borys initiated the Dragon metamorphosis.
Good point. I'm trying to consult the time line on Nyt's page but its not there. Hmmmmm....