Where did the Belcadiz Elves come from? and how come they have a Tree of Life?
The problem is that the timeline in the Glantri Gaz says they arrived in 2200 BC. Now that I think about it, I'm pretty sure what I read was from the Vaults; it suggested that the group split in the SC. Then, long after the SC group developed their culture along side the humans, then moved on to rejoin the group in Glantri.
Anybody else have a better memory?
As for their possession of a Tree of Life - that's a DM's call. They were one of the options for placing the unallocated trees in Gaz5 so they may have one of the original 10, they could have got a child tree from another clan when they were discovered, or they could have something totally different.
I really need to go back and recheck Gazes 3 and 5.
I guess this was discussed before...
Where did the Belcadiz Elves come from? and how come they have a Tree of Life?
*Whew* there was a long discussion about this on the MML some time ago. It was pretty complicated, but I think the Belcadiz left Grunland around the same time as Ilsundal, but journeyed with some other clans (meditor, verdier, sheyalla) and met up with Isundal briefly on the Sc, before preceeding to the Known World, staying in Thyatis for a while before moving into the Glantri area. Their dark complection is simply attributed to how they had been since the time of Grunland. Their culture has been tried connected with the SC and Thyatian culture, but it just doesnt fit timewise. So it makes sense of they've just developed such a culture on their own...
Håvard
Also going on flaky memory - I thought they had been in Glantri a LOT longer. One of the major disasters (may have been THE cataclysm, may not) happened after they were there and they went underground for a bit. At least that's what I think I remember.
The pale-skinned elves who'd lived in Glantri until the Broken Lands disaster never came back to Glantri. They split up into several groups; one emerged in the Five Shires as the Gentle Folk, one came up in the Hollow World and became the Icevale elves (whose culture recreated their original "Glantrian mountain-folk" habits, thanks to the Spell of Preservation), and a third was decimated by the hazards of the subterranean world until only Atziann (aka Atzanteotl) remained. Reports are contradictory as to whether the remaining group(s) of Glantrian underground refugees: A) became the shadow elves; B) joined a pre-existing shadow elf society dating from the GRoF; or C) became the Shattenalfen.
IIRC, there's a "History of the Ispan Peoples" on the VoP website, which also mentions a possible origin for the Belcadiz clan. I don't recall details, but I believe the clan was exiled by the Ispanicized elves for using witchcraft to try to usurp control of their nation. As for skin color, I expect there'd been a certain amount of Ispan human/elf intermarriage (or at least fooling around) over the generations. Note that even under the OD&D "no half-elves" policy as presented in the Alfheim Gaz, some genetic exchange between the races is possible: hybrids simply breed back into their parental types, bringing trivial bits of heritable features -- like a dark complexion -- along with them.
IIRC, there's a "History of the Ispan Peoples" on the VoP website, which also mentions a possible origin for the Belcadiz clan.
there's http://dnd.starflung.com/ispan.html and notes to that in http://dnd.starflung.com/ispan2.html
We have been discussing it in our Mystara Italian forum as well, and I must say we came out with a pretty idea for these weird elves and for their strange and so-far unexplained tie to the Ispan culture.
I wouldn't have posted it before it was whole, but just to give you the basics and let your brain work on it ... ;)
Basically the darker complexion is already been there, and they were the second group that fled Grunland shortly after Ilsundal departed, joining with him after crossing the Addakian Sound and prior migrating to Brun.
Then they along with other "fair elves" came to Glantri e settled there. Up to this point, they were not yet the flamenco elves, just a bit more tanned (prolly same stock as Verdier), bolder and hotter-tempered.
Then the Glantrian catastrophe came, and the elves fled deep down the earth. Some emerged in Five Shires region (Gentle Folk), some in the Hollow World (Icevale and Atziann) and some emerged not so far from the Thyatian coast, on the isle that is now called Terentias. And yes, you guessed it right: these were the Belcadiz.
They stayed alone for many centuries, much like their neighbour Verdier and Meditor, both groups ignoring the other's existence, up to the time when the Nithians began settling the southern isles (with Minroth). Some nithians brought with them slaves from the Alatian Isles (descendents of the alasyians.. never thought of the assonance of the names alatian and alasyian? ;) also check out GAZ2 for the real origin of these alasyians, who are different from nithians) and settled Terentias around 1000 BC as well as parts of Thyatian mainland (at that time still occupied by toralai tribes - source HW).
But the Belcadiz stayed hidden in their woods, and the nithians never discovered them really.
Then the Thyatians, Kerendans and Hattians came in BC 600, and some Kerendans settled in Terentias as well, warring with Nithians for the island. The Kerendans won with the help of the alasyian slaves and the elves, who revealed themselves. IN the next centuries, Terentias civilization was a mix of alasyian-kerendan-elvish and from this came out the Ispan culture and the Belcadiz flamenco elves.
Terentias had many bulls on its soil and the Belcadiz were already a fan of bullfights before the kerendans came for example, lending this attitude to the kerendans becoming ispans, while the mix of alasyians and kerendans made the darker complexion of the ispans as well as their unique language, which the elves partly adopted using ispan words in their otherwise truly elven tongue, creating thus a unique belcadiz dialect.
Obviously with the total memory reset of the Immortals after the fall of Nithia, none of them ever remembered the NIthians and so they went on living together.
Terentias was always rather distant from mainland Thyatis, a rather contested land between Thyatis and Minrothad, and stood its ground for many decades, being occupied for small lapses of time by one or another of the two nations, but the elves always managed to stay hidden from the other humans (hey, if the Minrothad elves did, why not the Belcadiz!) ;)
Then in AC 700 something happened (we're still working on this, prolly Thyatis moved in with major legionnaires to claim Terentias once and for all) and the elves decided to abandon the island, refusing to subdue. Helped by their friends the Meditor, they were "spirited away" in secret and landed in Athenos, where they came to know that the long abandoned Glantri (their formeer homeland in Brun) had been settled by humans and was now ripe for colonization. Thus appearing apparently from nowhere they marched northwards claiming to be "coming from south of Tanegioth" and being descendants of the first elves settlers of Glantri.
They were later joined by Erewan elves around AC730, and the two groups merged. It was the Erewans who gave them a children Tree of Life as sign of friendship and union, and from them they learnt the faith of Ilsundal. After they split, the Belcadiz ketp the ToL anyway, since it is a major artifact and can always be useful (they don't really follow Ilsundal)
Stay tuned for other revelations : we're now working on the history of Darokin and its language (and have already written down the complete history of the rakasta) ;)
LATER ADDITION
Unfortunately, after checking out Terentias' size, I have to conclude that this theory doesn't hold, because Terentias is too small to have made possible for Ispan and Belcadiz civilizations to prosper and thrive for so many years together. Therefore you have to ditch this idea (that's why I was so uncomfortable with exposing it before having checked everything :p)
Well it's a pretty tough topic.
Stay tuned for other revelations : we're now working on the history of Darokin and its language (and have already written down the complete history of the rakasta) ;)
I would love to see all this in English.
:DOkay, roughly speaking this is the chronology:
1700 BC: Some elves trigger a big Blackmoor device on the border between Glantri and the Broken Lands, creating a nuclear catastrophe. Many elves flee beneath the earth, but the Belcadiz clan manages to use a special device they had been experimenting in the last years: a magical Gate (think about a Stargate). The whole clan (except those elves infected by the nuclear disease, who are left behind on pourpose) passes through it and emerges in an unknown land, destroying the Gate after the passage to prevent a future invasion by unknown forces.
1699 BC: The Belcadiz elves discover they are now living on a big island whose whereaboouts are unknown. They rename it ALVAR. After exploring Alvar, they discover there are no other sentient races living there, and proceed to settle it, trying to discover their whereabouts (for all they know they could be on another plane, since their experiment was targeted on exploring the Multiverse through the use of magical gates).
1650 BC: the Belcadiz elves have tried to use their magics to scry this world and have indeed discovered that they are still on Mystara, although their exact location is uncertain (bear in mind they have no clerics among them). They try to use mundane means of exploration, and go seafaring.
1600 BC: After some major disasters at sea (due to the bad weather, acquatic monsters, hostile acquatic races and unskilled shipwrights), the Belcadiz conclude they are not a seaborne race, so they instead spend the following centuries exploring the island and adapting to it, building new cities and growing their already dwindling numbers (the survivors of the Glantrian Catastrophe were only 2000 Belcadiz elves).
1600 BC - 500 AC : During this period the Belcadiz of Alvar thrive on the island (whose dimensions are roughly similar to Trader's Isle and it's located between Tanegioth and Ochalea), becoming a very unique culture of bold, touchy, fearsome elves. They love to make mock wars and duels among themselves, have a superior craftmanship for swords and develop a unique form of sorcery called witchcraft.
In BC 990 a large group of NIthian explorers passes nearby but doesn't notice Alvar, which is then left alone, especially after the Nithian colonies on Davania rebel and throw their masters out (or maybe the Belcadiz are indeed invaded by NIthians but are able to drive them away of Alvar...).
500 AC: Following the conquest of the Tel Akbir Peninsula and the following wars in Ylaruam, many Kerendan noblemen are put in front of a difficult choice: to go warring against the Alphatian in the ylari desert or to try to settle into new lands in the southern continent or in the western isles (Ierendi). Many of them take the route southwards and finally find Tanegioth, Alvar and the Hinterlands, relocating there with their belongings and their slaves (mostly alasyian of Tel Akbir). Some colonies fall after just one decade (Tanegioth and Davania), while on Alvar the newly come Kerendan are able to come to terms with the elves.
510 AC: Fearing an all-out invasion, the Belcadiz (using the charming powers of their witches) are able to persuade the Kerendan leaders to beguile the thyatian government. After the total collapse of the colonies in Davania and Tanegioth, the Kerendan nobles of Alvar tell stories of diseases, cannibal savages and a bleak land to discourage new settlers and throw off Thyatis' attention on their dominion. They are then encouraged to resist and fend off for themleves, levying taxes yearly.
The Kerendans and elves cooperate to remain independent, and gradually the Kerendans mix with their alasyians slaves, changing their skin tone and language in the following 4 centuries, thus becoming the Ispans. Moreover, they share their love for bullfights and cavalry with the elves, as well as their history, and the elves discover that there are whole new continents north and south of Alvar to explore.
AC 510 - 690 : After 2 centuries of intermixing, the flamenco elves and the Ispan culture have been created. Ispans are adventuresome folks who venture often by sea and take with them the Belcadiz elves, who in turn discover new lands and come back to report.
During one of these explorations in the Broken Lands, the elves discover remains of their old sites and their magical Gate, and understand that their ancestral home is now inhabited by pale humans with tremendous magical knowledge called Flaems.
AC 700 : the isle of Alvar shows worring signs of instability. Earthquakes shake its mountains and lowlands, water becomes incredibly hot and fishes die around its coasts. The Belcadiz and Ispan scholars determine that the ancient volcano has indeed come to life once again, and many families are worried.
AC 705 : It is now clear that Alvar will experience a serious earthquake or probably something more terrible in the near future. Many ispan settlers abandon their estates and move to nearby thyatian colonies or return to the mainland, hoping to find a place to live (and some are forced to settle on the ylari border). Belcadiz try to use once again magic to have an escape route just in case the situation grows worse, refusing to abandon the isle where they've been living in the last 2000 years. Some elves are dispatched in the Broken Lands where they must try to rebuild the old Gate, while other mages in Alvar build a similar one.
AC 720 : Disaster strucks when the isle of Alvar starts sinking into the sea after a terrible earthquake awakens the ancestral volcano. The few Ispans remaining on the isle plea the elves for help, and they both leave the island using the Magical Gate, coming once again in Brun through the one in the northern Broken Lands.
Here, (as GAZ3 says) braving the dangers of the Broken Lands, southern elves (around 15,000) find a trail back to Glantri and settle in modern New Alvar (Nueva Alvar) along with their human followers (no more than 1,000).
AC 900 : The displaced Ispans, in search of a new home after the thyatian colonies in Ylaruam have been destroyed by Al-Kalim, accept to sail westwards and settle west of the Gulf of Hule, in the new world. Here they create the Barony of Narvaez under the leadership of the Narvaez family.
AC 910 : The obsession of the Narvaez family with the cult of Ixion and their persecution of the witchcraft leads many Ispans to revolt and causes other baronies to be founded by secessionists. Thyatis is too far to intervene and Narvaez must cope with insurrections the best it can.
During the following years new Kerendan, dwarvish and ylari settlers come to the area of the Savage Coast and join the Ispans, finally creating the Savage Baronies.
Now, can it work?