The Order of Gond Haephestus - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

The Order of Gond Haephestus

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
zombiegleemax
Oct 04, 2004 11:22:43 Here's a little sect I came up with. I'm using a system similar to Unearthed Arcana's character traits for sect and faction abilities, by the way, as it seemed most similar to the old 2nd ed way of doing things.

The Order of Gond-Haephestus
[the Simplifiers, the Teachers]
Sect Philosophy: Unlike material wealth, giving information to another does not diminish your own store of information. Giving information incurs no hardship on the giver, and grants betterment to the receiver. Information is power. Power should not be horded. A monopoly of information is a tyranny. Information must be freely given to all. Those who do not understand the value of learning must be brought to appreciate it. If everyone is educated, then all will be able to look after themselves, contribute to their community and treat their fellow citizens with respect.
Technological proliferation is the key to a utopian society. Magic is powerful, possibly more powerful than any technology, but technology can be understood by all. It operates on physical principals that are infinitely less difficult to grasp than magic. Magic is an elite pursuit. Only the brightest minds and strongest wills can grasp its principals. Technology liberates the masses whilst magic alienates them. Nevertheless, the Order do not exclude spellcasters, they merely require them to add any spells they know to their libraries and, like any member, to take on apprentices, if requested, without compensation.
Some have started calling the Order's members "Simplifiers". This is intended to be derogatory, implying that the Order believes that they can take incredibly complex ideas an make them accessible to all, a feat their detractors say is possible only by simplifying the ideas in question to such a degree as to render them meaningless. Their second nickname, "Teachers", is more self explainatory and more respectful.
Primary Plane of Influence: Bytopia is at the heart of this new movement, and the growing technological understanding of Bytopia's gnomes is the primary catalyst for this growth. The sect also has adherents who hail from Mechanus, although they tend more towards the study of the natural sciences and leave the dissemination of their discoveries to their Bytopian colleagues.
Allies and Enemies: The Fraternity of Order has great respect for the cultivation of the intellect espoused by the Order of Gond-Haephestus, although some of its members with more arcane leanings are suspicious of the order's ambivalence towards magic. The Free League approves of the Order's drive to make knowledge available to all rather than just an intellectual elite. However, the Fated are peery of the Order's belief that knowledge must be given to everyone. Surely, they say, if a cutter's not able to find the dark himself, he doesn't deserve to be given it just like that?
Eligibility: Anyone may join the Order, although those who practice magic might be somewhat suspicious, and vice versa. Likewise, those with an evil alignment aren't likely to take to the Order's desire to share.
Benefits: All Knowledge skills are counted as class skills for Simplifiers, since they have ready access to information. Simplifiers may use knowledge skills untrained, since they may have picked up a modest amount of information on any subject. Bard Simplifiers, or those with an ability similar to Bardic Knowledge, may add +2 to their roll when using this skill.
Restrictions: The Order's members must devote some of their time to tutoring others in a field with which they are familiar. The Order will often assign a pupil to a master, in which case the master tutor the pupil daily (usually for an hour or so) and so must take the student with him should he go travelling extensively (or adventuring), and ensure the pupil's safety whilst he does so. Only in the most extreme circumstances can a member refuse to take on a pupil. However, this system works both ways. A member may be both a pupil and a tutor at the same time, and usually is, sharing his knowledge with one person whilst learning more from another. A member who wishes to become a pupil makes a request to the Order, who then finds a suitable tutor. Any member may make such a request, and may take multiple tutors similtaneously so long as they can cope with the workload and all the tutors in question live sufficiently close together to make daily tuition practical.
#2
GothicDan
Oct 04, 2004 13:59:06 I really like the sect's idea overall... A philosophy that I definitely respect from an OOC point of view, too. But there's just one small thing I noticed with the benefits. Wizards already have all Knowledge as class skills, so what would they gain from joining the sect, if anything?
#3
zombiegleemax
Oct 04, 2004 15:09:19 The mechanical benefits for single class wizards are, admittedly, practically nonexistent. However, bear in mind that the sect would be a very useful source of new spells. All you need do is request a spell from a fellow member and they would be duty bound to open their spell book for you, and all you need do in return is reciprocate. Admittedly this is a benefit for all other magic users, but since only wizards work from spellbooks, they stand to gain from it more. Not sure if this ensures game balance, but game balance was never something I was terribly good at anyway, nor something I pay as much attention as I should to... ;)
#4
sildatorak
Oct 04, 2004 15:40:50 The wizard would still have to pay money to actually copy the spell, still. The price given for an NPC wizard allowing a PC wizard to copy a spell is 50 gp/spell level. The cost to actually copy it is 100 gp/spell level (unless their is a blessed book involved) for a total of 150 gp/level, normally. With this setup the wizard will only pay 100 gp/level. I think that a 33% discount on the gp cost of getting new spells is reasonable, especially if you set this sect up as a small organization with a limited supply of known spells. Like you said, they don't get many wizard members; so who is writing the spells down in the first place?
#5
zombiegleemax
Oct 04, 2004 16:19:05 Ah. Well... Perhaps since they aren't that fond of spellcasters, I shouldn't try too hard to make the organisation seem welcoming to them.
#6
GothicDan
Oct 05, 2004 13:57:01 Well, I believe that the Fraternity of Order Wizards in particular would be quick to point out that it takes a certain level of intelligence to comprehend anything, be it technology or wizardry. In truth, people of a very low intelligence can't even use something as simple as a spoon properly, so sharing knowledge with such a person would be equivalent to sharing knowledge of magic with an average person.

Doing absolutely anything to a high degree requires a certain high level of capacity in the given field, so it would be terribly biased of the Order to be prejudiced against arcane magic... After all, it takes a lot of "wisdom" to know how to interpret a deity's doctrine properly (be a cleric), and a lot of "dexterity" to implement the knowledge of picking a lock..

Not a very "informed" thing for them to do, don't you think? ;)
#7
factol_rhys_dup
Oct 05, 2004 18:37:18
Well, I believe that the Fraternity of Order Wizards in particular would be quick to point out that it takes a certain level of intelligence to comprehend anything, be it technology or wizardry. In truth, people of a very low intelligence can't even use something as simple as a spoon properly, so sharing knowledge with such a person would be equivalent to sharing knowledge of magic with an average person.

I'm sorry, but there aren't any circumstances in which spoon-use is equivalent to the secrets of wizardry.
#8
zombiegleemax
Oct 06, 2004 8:16:07 Firstly, on the subject of spoons, there is one spoon related operation which I think requires PhD level spoonology. My great uncle can, I believe, use the spoons as a musical instrument. It's what they did before the dawn of the age of television.

Besides, I don't think the order is trying to churn out a multiverse full of professors. What it wants is a group of well educated, well informed people. Besides, since when have factions or sects had goals that were achievable? They seem to specialise more in the undoable, like destroying the gods or enforcing order on a multiversal scale.
#9
GothicDan
Oct 06, 2004 15:55:57 I was just putting for a philosophical argument, mind you. I wasn't trying to actually say there was anything innately wrong.

And Rhys, have you ever seen a low-functioning autistic kid? Using a spoon for them WOULD be magical.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 zombiegleemax Oct 04, 2004 11:22:43	Here's a little sect I came up with. I'm using a system similar to Unearthed Arcana's character traits for sect and faction abilities, by the way, as it seemed most similar to the old 2nd ed way of doing things. The Order of Gond-Haephestus [the Simplifiers, the Teachers] Sect Philosophy: Unlike material wealth, giving information to another does not diminish your own store of information. Giving information incurs no hardship on the giver, and grants betterment to the receiver. Information is power. Power should not be horded. A monopoly of information is a tyranny. Information must be freely given to all. Those who do not understand the value of learning must be brought to appreciate it. If everyone is educated, then all will be able to look after themselves, contribute to their community and treat their fellow citizens with respect. Technological proliferation is the key to a utopian society. Magic is powerful, possibly more powerful than any technology, but technology can be understood by all. It operates on physical principals that are infinitely less difficult to grasp than magic. Magic is an elite pursuit. Only the brightest minds and strongest wills can grasp its principals. Technology liberates the masses whilst magic alienates them. Nevertheless, the Order do not exclude spellcasters, they merely require them to add any spells they know to their libraries and, like any member, to take on apprentices, if requested, without compensation. Some have started calling the Order's members "Simplifiers". This is intended to be derogatory, implying that the Order believes that they can take incredibly complex ideas an make them accessible to all, a feat their detractors say is possible only by simplifying the ideas in question to such a degree as to render them meaningless. Their second nickname, "Teachers", is more self explainatory and more respectful. Primary Plane of Influence: Bytopia is at the heart of this new movement, and the growing technological understanding of Bytopia's gnomes is the primary catalyst for this growth. The sect also has adherents who hail from Mechanus, although they tend more towards the study of the natural sciences and leave the dissemination of their discoveries to their Bytopian colleagues. Allies and Enemies: The Fraternity of Order has great respect for the cultivation of the intellect espoused by the Order of Gond-Haephestus, although some of its members with more arcane leanings are suspicious of the order's ambivalence towards magic. The Free League approves of the Order's drive to make knowledge available to all rather than just an intellectual elite. However, the Fated are peery of the Order's belief that knowledge must be given to everyone. Surely, they say, if a cutter's not able to find the dark himself, he doesn't deserve to be given it just like that? Eligibility: Anyone may join the Order, although those who practice magic might be somewhat suspicious, and vice versa. Likewise, those with an evil alignment aren't likely to take to the Order's desire to share. Benefits: All Knowledge skills are counted as class skills for Simplifiers, since they have ready access to information. Simplifiers may use knowledge skills untrained, since they may have picked up a modest amount of information on any subject. Bard Simplifiers, or those with an ability similar to Bardic Knowledge, may add +2 to their roll when using this skill. Restrictions: The Order's members must devote some of their time to tutoring others in a field with which they are familiar. The Order will often assign a pupil to a master, in which case the master tutor the pupil daily (usually for an hour or so) and so must take the student with him should he go travelling extensively (or adventuring), and ensure the pupil's safety whilst he does so. Only in the most extreme circumstances can a member refuse to take on a pupil. However, this system works both ways. A member may be both a pupil and a tutor at the same time, and usually is, sharing his knowledge with one person whilst learning more from another. A member who wishes to become a pupil makes a request to the Order, who then finds a suitable tutor. Any member may make such a request, and may take multiple tutors similtaneously so long as they can cope with the workload and all the tutors in question live sufficiently close together to make daily tuition practical.
#2 GothicDan Oct 04, 2004 13:59:06	I really like the sect's idea overall... A philosophy that I definitely respect from an OOC point of view, too. But there's just one small thing I noticed with the benefits. Wizards already have all Knowledge as class skills, so what would they gain from joining the sect, if anything?
#3 zombiegleemax Oct 04, 2004 15:09:19	The mechanical benefits for single class wizards are, admittedly, practically nonexistent. However, bear in mind that the sect would be a very useful source of new spells. All you need do is request a spell from a fellow member and they would be duty bound to open their spell book for you, and all you need do in return is reciprocate. Admittedly this is a benefit for all other magic users, but since only wizards work from spellbooks, they stand to gain from it more. Not sure if this ensures game balance, but game balance was never something I was terribly good at anyway, nor something I pay as much attention as I should to... ;)
#4 sildatorak Oct 04, 2004 15:40:50	The wizard would still have to pay money to actually copy the spell, still. The price given for an NPC wizard allowing a PC wizard to copy a spell is 50 gp/spell level. The cost to actually copy it is 100 gp/spell level (unless their is a blessed book involved) for a total of 150 gp/level, normally. With this setup the wizard will only pay 100 gp/level. I think that a 33% discount on the gp cost of getting new spells is reasonable, especially if you set this sect up as a small organization with a limited supply of known spells. Like you said, they don't get many wizard members; so who is writing the spells down in the first place?
#5 zombiegleemax Oct 04, 2004 16:19:05	Ah. Well... Perhaps since they aren't that fond of spellcasters, I shouldn't try too hard to make the organisation seem welcoming to them.
#6 GothicDan Oct 05, 2004 13:57:01	Well, I believe that the Fraternity of Order Wizards in particular would be quick to point out that it takes a certain level of intelligence to comprehend anything, be it technology or wizardry. In truth, people of a very low intelligence can't even use something as simple as a spoon properly, so sharing knowledge with such a person would be equivalent to sharing knowledge of magic with an average person. Doing absolutely anything to a high degree requires a certain high level of capacity in the given field, so it would be terribly biased of the Order to be prejudiced against arcane magic... After all, it takes a lot of "wisdom" to know how to interpret a deity's doctrine properly (be a cleric), and a lot of "dexterity" to implement the knowledge of picking a lock.. Not a very "informed" thing for them to do, don't you think? ;)
#7 factol_rhys_dup Oct 05, 2004 18:37:18	Well, I believe that the Fraternity of Order Wizards in particular would be quick to point out that it takes a certain level of intelligence to comprehend anything, be it technology or wizardry. In truth, people of a very low intelligence can't even use something as simple as a spoon properly, so sharing knowledge with such a person would be equivalent to sharing knowledge of magic with an average person. I'm sorry, but there aren't any circumstances in which spoon-use is equivalent to the secrets of wizardry.
#8 zombiegleemax Oct 06, 2004 8:16:07	Firstly, on the subject of spoons, there is one spoon related operation which I think requires PhD level spoonology. My great uncle can, I believe, use the spoons as a musical instrument. It's what they did before the dawn of the age of television. Besides, I don't think the order is trying to churn out a multiverse full of professors. What it wants is a group of well educated, well informed people. Besides, since when have factions or sects had goals that were achievable? They seem to specialise more in the undoable, like destroying the gods or enforcing order on a multiversal scale.
#9 GothicDan Oct 06, 2004 15:55:57	I was just putting for a philosophical argument, mind you. I wasn't trying to actually say there was anything innately wrong. And Rhys, have you ever seen a low-functioning autistic kid? Using a spoon for them WOULD be magical.