[Discussion] Marking Slaves - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

[Discussion] Marking Slaves

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
bengeldorn
Oct 28, 2004 16:13:19 I was wondering how slaves are being marked.
These are the ones I came up to:

- Tattoo
- Branding
- Shave
- Magic mark
- Psionic mark
- Fixed Item (for example: neck bell)

The optimal slave mark should fullfill following criterias (IMHO):
- difficult to get rid off
- not permanent / eraseable
- identification of the slave's owner
- ability of changing the identification
- detectable by slave scent *
- easily recognizable
- able to use on any race

* As it difficult to say wether or not a mark could fullfill the criteria, it is kept of unless it part of the mark.

PROS and CONS
Tattoo
- difficult to get rid off
- identification of the slave's owner
- easily recognizable
- permanent / not eraseable
- identification not changeable (you could add a new tattoo, but a often selled slave would be full of tattoos then)
- it could get difficult to make a tattoo on other materials than hide (how are aarakocras being tattooed?)

Branding
- difficult to get rid off
- identification of the slave's owner
- easily recognizable
- useable on any race
- permanent / not eraseable
- identification not changeable (like tattos, see above)

Shave
- easily recognizable
- not permanent / eraseable
- easy to get rid off (unless you are naturally bald)
- unuseable on any race (bald aarakocras would look ridiculous, Thri-kreens don't have hairs)
- not able to identificate the slave's owner
- identification not changeable

Magic mark
- difficult to get rid off
- not permanent / eraseable
- identification of the slave's owner
- ability of changing the identification
- detectable by slave scent
- able to use on any race
- easily recognizable (unless it could be also seen without using magic or psi)
- could only be made by spellcasters (for example templars)

Psionic mark
- difficult to get rid off
- not permanent / eraseable
- identification of the slave's owner
- ability of changing the identification
- detectable by slave scent
- able to use on any race
- easily recognizable (unless it could be also seen without using magic or psi)
- could only be made by manifesters (for example psions)

Fixed Item
- not permanent / eraseable
- identification of the slave's owner
- ability of changing the identification
- easily recognizable
- able to use on any race
- depending on the material and kind of the item it could be easy or difficult to get rid off it, that's why I can't decide wether or not it is a pro or con, but as the IMO only metal would make it realy difficvult to get rid off it, and the fact that metall is rare on athas it tend to take this as a con.

I tend to say, that a magic and/or psionic mark are the "best" marks.

Any other ideas? Do you see other criterias that are important?
Be welcome to add or discuss things, I need some info about this.
#2
Grummore
Oct 28, 2004 18:41:39 Bendeldorn, have you created many things on the slave subject?

Please send me a mail.

ds3 [ at ] siltskimmer.net

Thanks!
#3
bengeldorn
Oct 28, 2004 20:47:42
Bendeldorn, have you created many things on the slave subject?

Please send me a mail.

ds3 [ at ] siltskimmer.net

Thanks!

No not yet, I was just wondering how slave scent works. I was also asking myself, how slaves are being marked. Regualr tattoos doesn't work for me as I noted above, slaves are also trading goods and some often change their owner and without laser chirurgery it would only be magical possible to change this mark. I see the same problem with brandings. I dropped shaving imediatelly, but I noted it here, because I found this by searching the forum.
So there had been psionic marks and magic marks left over.
I'm tending to magic marks, as this would fit very well with the templar's ability of his sigil arcane mark. The only probleme I have with this is, that only templars and wizards are able to use this spell, but as arcane magic is illegal only templars would be able to mark slaves. First I hadn't a problem with this but then I was thinking of trading houses and small villages that weren't able to mark their slaves unless they find a templar. That doesn't fit so either for me. Now I'm playing with the idea to create a spell and/or power, that would be usable with the templar's sigil and other classes (like psions and/or clerics). This spell/power would mark a person as a slave and he now would be detectable by slave scent. This mark is optical visible for every person (who's able to see ). The mark is indiviually and read magic, Decipher Script and/or a power that could do similar would reveal the owner.
This mark should be able to be dispelled/nullified by it's owner with a secret command-word, only the owner knows. Changing the mark without permission should be very difficult (except for templars)....

As you see these are all just thoughts, and I started this thread to get new imperssions and maybe new/different ideas....
#4
Pennarin
Oct 28, 2004 22:22:03 Slave scent detects the status of a creature magically.
Abracadabra. Pouf.
It just works and is fool-proof.
#5
zombiegleemax
Oct 28, 2004 23:02:28 There could be two methods, one to simply mark as a slave and one to show ownership. The removal of a pinky would be a nice permanant casting, and the removal of the tongue (while not practiced routinely) would be an obvious sign.

I would guess that few slaves get frequently traded (only being sold in times of crises, after the owners death, or for a very tempting offer), so the prospect of a slave being covered in tattoos would not really be an issue. Marks would likely identify a house/family/templarate/SM rather than an individual, so heredity exchange would not require any new markings. I imagine many slave owners would have no problem with removing a tattoo by simply taking a chunk of flesh with it. There would also be a tattoo to mark an ex-slave as such (easil verified by a local templar: they would detect a freeman or a slave, and probably execute the individual in the latter case).

Slave scent has some interesting implications. A slave would detect as a slave from the moment they are captured. I imagine a slave who has escaped would still be detected as a slave no matter how long they have been free. An escaped slave who has somehow married or been adopted into another caste would detect as both (what does a templar say when the noble patriarch is clearly a slave?), and a person would only register as a caste if recognised as such by the templar's city.

e.g. Hunna of Delera, a Urikite noble, is captured by slavers and sold in Nibenay. A Urikite templar would recognise her as an imprisoned noble, a Nibenese templar would detect a simple slave, and I imagine a Gulgan would detect both. I don't imagine the spell would give any information apart from caste, so the Gulgan would probably rely on Hunna's accent to figure things out.
#6
Pennarin
Oct 29, 2004 0:14:31
Slave scent has some interesting implications. A slave would detect as a slave from the moment they are captured. I imagine a slave who has escaped would still be detected as a slave no matter how long they have been free. An escaped slave who has somehow married or been adopted into another caste would detect as both (what does a templar say when the noble patriarch is clearly a slave?), and a person would only register as a caste if recognised as such by the templar's city.

e.g. Hunna of Delera, a Urikite noble, is captured by slavers and sold in Nibenay. A Urikite templar would recognise her as an imprisoned noble, a Nibenese templar would detect a simple slave, and I imagine a Gulgan would detect both. I don't imagine the spell would give any information apart from caste, so the Gulgan would probably rely on Hunna's accent to figure things out.

Good examples. I think the same would happen: once a slave, always a slave.
#7
zombiegleemax
Oct 29, 2004 12:12:43 My 0.2 cents on this: I don't think slaves to be sold so often. Slaveholders usualy doesn't purchase a slave until they need it to work. And than they don't sell it over, they make him work. A slave has its value only because it has a working capacity. Sooner or later it will find an owner, who will use it for work, that's why it's purchased.

Of course bad things can happen, a slaveholder needs cash fast and therfore he sell some slaves, but normal ways the slave is working for his owner till death. When a lot of slaves appear on the market it's usually because they are spoils of war.

What my point is: re-selling a slave is much more rare, than purchasing one. It means that tattoes and brands are good as slave marks, as ereaseability of the slave marks is not so much concern. A slave usually dies before he has more than two different owner. The majority of them has only one in his whole (miserable) life. And don't forget, that there are a lot of ownership change which doesn't need to change the slave mark. E.g. if the head fo the family dies, and the son takes over the slaves remain in the same family, no need to change the mark. The slaves of a sorcerer monarch can be assigned under one templar to another, but the mark again doesn't need to be changed.

For me using magical/psionic marks for every slave is way over the top. Marking a top gladiator, the literate sage of the family or similar special, valuable slaves is ok, but for the normal field/mine worker the mundane marks should do.
#8
the_peacebringer
Oct 29, 2004 12:39:00 It would be logical to believe that in the month or so before the Dragon comes to take its levy, some City-states would make it possible for slave owners to sell their laziest or most troublesome slaves, if they wish (those that have survived, anyways). Of course, in that case, it doesn't really matter what brand the slave wears...

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 bengeldorn Oct 28, 2004 16:13:19	I was wondering how slaves are being marked. These are the ones I came up to: - Tattoo - Branding - Shave - Magic mark - Psionic mark - Fixed Item (for example: neck bell) The optimal slave mark should fullfill following criterias (IMHO): - difficult to get rid off - not permanent / eraseable - identification of the slave's owner - ability of changing the identification - detectable by slave scent * - easily recognizable - able to use on any race * As it difficult to say wether or not a mark could fullfill the criteria, it is kept of unless it part of the mark. PROS and CONS Tattoo - difficult to get rid off - identification of the slave's owner - easily recognizable - permanent / not eraseable - identification not changeable (you could add a new tattoo, but a often selled slave would be full of tattoos then) - it could get difficult to make a tattoo on other materials than hide (how are aarakocras being tattooed?) Branding - difficult to get rid off - identification of the slave's owner - easily recognizable - useable on any race - permanent / not eraseable - identification not changeable (like tattos, see above) Shave - easily recognizable - not permanent / eraseable - easy to get rid off (unless you are naturally bald) - unuseable on any race (bald aarakocras would look ridiculous, Thri-kreens don't have hairs) - not able to identificate the slave's owner - identification not changeable Magic mark - difficult to get rid off - not permanent / eraseable - identification of the slave's owner - ability of changing the identification - detectable by slave scent - able to use on any race - easily recognizable (unless it could be also seen without using magic or psi) - could only be made by spellcasters (for example templars) Psionic mark - difficult to get rid off - not permanent / eraseable - identification of the slave's owner - ability of changing the identification - detectable by slave scent - able to use on any race - easily recognizable (unless it could be also seen without using magic or psi) - could only be made by manifesters (for example psions) Fixed Item - not permanent / eraseable - identification of the slave's owner - ability of changing the identification - easily recognizable - able to use on any race - depending on the material and kind of the item it could be easy or difficult to get rid off it, that's why I can't decide wether or not it is a pro or con, but as the IMO only metal would make it realy difficvult to get rid off it, and the fact that metall is rare on athas it tend to take this as a con. I tend to say, that a magic and/or psionic mark are the "best" marks. Any other ideas? Do you see other criterias that are important? Be welcome to add or discuss things, I need some info about this.
#2 Grummore Oct 28, 2004 18:41:39	Bendeldorn, have you created many things on the slave subject? Please send me a mail. ds3 [ at ] siltskimmer.net Thanks!
#3 bengeldorn Oct 28, 2004 20:47:42	Bendeldorn, have you created many things on the slave subject? Please send me a mail. ds3 [ at ] siltskimmer.net Thanks! No not yet, I was just wondering how slave scent works. I was also asking myself, how slaves are being marked. Regualr tattoos doesn't work for me as I noted above, slaves are also trading goods and some often change their owner and without laser chirurgery it would only be magical possible to change this mark. I see the same problem with brandings. I dropped shaving imediatelly, but I noted it here, because I found this by searching the forum. So there had been psionic marks and magic marks left over. I'm tending to magic marks, as this would fit very well with the templar's ability of his sigil arcane mark. The only probleme I have with this is, that only templars and wizards are able to use this spell, but as arcane magic is illegal only templars would be able to mark slaves. First I hadn't a problem with this but then I was thinking of trading houses and small villages that weren't able to mark their slaves unless they find a templar. That doesn't fit so either for me. Now I'm playing with the idea to create a spell and/or power, that would be usable with the templar's sigil and other classes (like psions and/or clerics). This spell/power would mark a person as a slave and he now would be detectable by slave scent. This mark is optical visible for every person (who's able to see ). The mark is indiviually and read magic, Decipher Script and/or a power that could do similar would reveal the owner. This mark should be able to be dispelled/nullified by it's owner with a secret command-word, only the owner knows. Changing the mark without permission should be very difficult (except for templars).... As you see these are all just thoughts, and I started this thread to get new imperssions and maybe new/different ideas....
#4 Pennarin Oct 28, 2004 22:22:03	Slave scent detects the status of a creature magically. Abracadabra. Pouf. It just works and is fool-proof.
#5 zombiegleemax Oct 28, 2004 23:02:28	There could be two methods, one to simply mark as a slave and one to show ownership. The removal of a pinky would be a nice permanant casting, and the removal of the tongue (while not practiced routinely) would be an obvious sign. I would guess that few slaves get frequently traded (only being sold in times of crises, after the owners death, or for a very tempting offer), so the prospect of a slave being covered in tattoos would not really be an issue. Marks would likely identify a house/family/templarate/SM rather than an individual, so heredity exchange would not require any new markings. I imagine many slave owners would have no problem with removing a tattoo by simply taking a chunk of flesh with it. There would also be a tattoo to mark an ex-slave as such (easil verified by a local templar: they would detect a freeman or a slave, and probably execute the individual in the latter case). Slave scent has some interesting implications. A slave would detect as a slave from the moment they are captured. I imagine a slave who has escaped would still be detected as a slave no matter how long they have been free. An escaped slave who has somehow married or been adopted into another caste would detect as both (what does a templar say when the noble patriarch is clearly a slave?), and a person would only register as a caste if recognised as such by the templar's city. e.g. Hunna of Delera, a Urikite noble, is captured by slavers and sold in Nibenay. A Urikite templar would recognise her as an imprisoned noble, a Nibenese templar would detect a simple slave, and I imagine a Gulgan would detect both. I don't imagine the spell would give any information apart from caste, so the Gulgan would probably rely on Hunna's accent to figure things out.
#6 Pennarin Oct 29, 2004 0:14:31	Slave scent has some interesting implications. A slave would detect as a slave from the moment they are captured. I imagine a slave who has escaped would still be detected as a slave no matter how long they have been free. An escaped slave who has somehow married or been adopted into another caste would detect as both (what does a templar say when the noble patriarch is clearly a slave?), and a person would only register as a caste if recognised as such by the templar's city. e.g. Hunna of Delera, a Urikite noble, is captured by slavers and sold in Nibenay. A Urikite templar would recognise her as an imprisoned noble, a Nibenese templar would detect a simple slave, and I imagine a Gulgan would detect both. I don't imagine the spell would give any information apart from caste, so the Gulgan would probably rely on Hunna's accent to figure things out. Good examples. I think the same would happen: once a slave, always a slave.
#7 zombiegleemax Oct 29, 2004 12:12:43	My 0.2 cents on this: I don't think slaves to be sold so often. Slaveholders usualy doesn't purchase a slave until they need it to work. And than they don't sell it over, they make him work. A slave has its value only because it has a working capacity. Sooner or later it will find an owner, who will use it for work, that's why it's purchased. Of course bad things can happen, a slaveholder needs cash fast and therfore he sell some slaves, but normal ways the slave is working for his owner till death. When a lot of slaves appear on the market it's usually because they are spoils of war. What my point is: re-selling a slave is much more rare, than purchasing one. It means that tattoes and brands are good as slave marks, as ereaseability of the slave marks is not so much concern. A slave usually dies before he has more than two different owner. The majority of them has only one in his whole (miserable) life. And don't forget, that there are a lot of ownership change which doesn't need to change the slave mark. E.g. if the head fo the family dies, and the son takes over the slaves remain in the same family, no need to change the mark. The slaves of a sorcerer monarch can be assigned under one templar to another, but the mark again doesn't need to be changed. For me using magical/psionic marks for every slave is way over the top. Marking a top gladiator, the literate sage of the family or similar special, valuable slaves is ok, but for the normal field/mine worker the mundane marks should do.
#8 the_peacebringer Oct 29, 2004 12:39:00	It would be logical to believe that in the month or so before the Dragon comes to take its levy, some City-states would make it possible for slave owners to sell their laziest or most troublesome slaves, if they wish (those that have survived, anyways). Of course, in that case, it doesn't really matter what brand the slave wears...