The only thing I've come across is that Kron is missing its village map symbol and Sybarate Isle is to big. I was also surprised not to see the G series adventure locations marked down, but most of the old adventure locations aren't noted.
Only thing I noted is that the Tomb of Tzunk's Hands is listed as the Tomb of Yagrax's Hands, in the NW map (right of the Barren Wastes label).
Apparently that was a correction of previous errata. It should always have been Yagrax.
Anyone found any errata so far?
The only thing I've come across is that Kron is missing its village map symbol and Sybarate Isle is to big. I was also surprised not to see the G series adventure locations marked down, but most of the old adventure locations aren't noted.
Good find! I have poured over the maps and never noticed that little blemish until you mentioned it. The "missing" village of Kron. An adventure may be brewing... ;)
......................................Omote
FPQ
The southeastern shoreline has an extra bulge and bay in it right where my campaign is centred.
And yeah, I miss the A series of adventures. Woulda been nice to know if there was an exact known location for the volcano Suderham used to be in.
I'm kinda annoyed at the Pomarj region. It's misshapen compared to all the other maps of the area I've seen.
The southeastern shoreline has an extra bulge and bay in it right where my campaign is centred.
And yeah, I miss the A series of adventures. Woulda been nice to know if there was an exact known location for the volcano Suderham used to be in.
At the risk of sounding insensitive to the recent Tsunami victims (apologies in advance, I mean no offense), a massive Oerthquake in the Pomarj (natural, magical...you decide) could explain the sudden change in the map resulting in your entire campaign region breaking away and being swallowed by the sea. Adventure hooks abound, assuming, of course, every PC survived the disaster. Ask every PC what they're doing with their "downtime". If they're in the region roleplay their attempt to survive. Retrieving personal belongings or valued items could be part II, with the newly reclaimed lands being swarmed over by Sahuigan (sp?) and other denizens of the deep.
Good find! I have poured over the maps and never noticed that little blemish until you mentioned it. The "missing" village of Kron. An adventure may be brewing... ;)
......................................Omote
FPQ
That's a cool idea. I like the sound of that, 'The Missing Village of Kron'.
I didn't notice that the Pomarj coastline had shifted until this post. Sure enough, Rob took a little bite out of the southeastern coast. Of course someone set their campaign there. Sorry!
As for Suderham. . . well, I confess that I left it out of the map for two reasons. One, it's secret (an unevenly applied metric, to be sure), and secondly, the place is called "Mt. Flamenbut," which is fantastically lame. Its location appears in the "Slavers!" adventure, for the over-curious.
There's an unfortunate error on the NE quadrant, which is the one that will arrive with 121. Somehow, the village of "Middle Nordran" turned into another "High Nordran," which is listed immediately next to it in North Kingdom.
Personally, I blame one of Xaene's heads.
--Erik Mona
Apparently that was a correction of previous errata. It should always have been Yagrax.
Oh, I hadn't heard that! Where was the correction from?
At the risk of sounding insensitive to the recent Tsunami victims (apologies in advance, I mean no offense)...
I think we all feel for the victims. There's obviously no intent to be insensitive here.
...a massive Oerthquake in the Pomarj (natural, magical...you decide) could explain the sudden change in the map resulting in your entire campaign region breaking away and being swallowed by the sea. Adventure hooks abound, assuming, of course, every PC survived the disaster. Ask every PC what they're doing with their "downtime". If they're in the region roleplay their attempt to survive. Retrieving personal belongings or valued items could be part II, with the newly reclaimed lands being swarmed over by Sahuigan (sp?) and other denizens of the deep.
If I was comfortable with the campaign already, I might just do that. But I'm just starting things up and I'm trying to get things "set in stone" before I begin whacking things with my DM's hammer. ;)
I didn't notice that the Pomarj coastline had shifted until this post. Sure enough, Rob took a little bite out of the southeastern coast. Of course someone set their campaign there. Sorry!
It's okay, I'm going with the map from Slavers. Counting the Dungeon maps, I now have five versions of the same area, and no two are even close to the same. I wish I could post them so y'all could laugh at me for choosing that one spot to base my campaign around.
As for Suderham. . . well, I confess that I left it out of the map for two reasons. One, it's secret (an unevenly applied metric, to be sure), and secondly, the place is called "Mt. Flamenbut," which is fantastically lame. Its location appears in the "Slavers!" adventure, for the over-curious.
Yup, I understand reason #1, it's what I expected the reason would be, and I agree with #2.
But I've been through Slavers several times to find an exact location without finding any mention of it. It's really in Mt. Flamenbut? Then...well, that's what I wanted to know. Thanks.
Hey, I only just noticed you answered my major question! That was pretty sneaky. (Either that, or I burnt my brain so badly playing poker today that even a direct answer seems like a bluff to me.) (It's highly possible.) (I lost five bucks.) (And it was nickel ante!) (I am in no way promoting the evil game of poker in this post.
)Thanks to Erik and his team for the new maps, which must be about the biggest thing to happen Greyhawk-wise since the LGG.
Waiting eagerly for the next.
So Flam(m)enblut = Flameblood = still lame for a volcano? You decide...
What does "Blue" mean in German, again?
--Erik
What does "Blue" mean in German, again?
"Rats." :D
The color blue is "blau" [rhymes with ow! as in when your in pain] in german.
Those rats are probably a special sort named blue or something like that.
Rat is Ratte in german.
A very cool dictionary/translation site: dict.leo.org
Oh and silly names are not really new with Gygax, are they? (In a part of Switzerland you speak Switzer Deutsch btw)
My favorite GH NPC name so far: Teldrol Storis.
Now, someone will probably point out that not showing them is just as well given it allows DM to use it no matter the starting date of their campaign. True, but the fact that certain cities are shown as "ruins" means the map displays a relatively recent Flanaess (probably 591 CY, if not later), so frontiers wouldn't have hurt.
I also wish they had shown major roads, something which has always been missing in large-scale maps of GH
Ah well, can't have everything I suppose...
Just got part 3. Still looking good. That said, I can't help but be slightly disappointed by the fact that regional borders aren't shown.
Now, someone will probably point out that not showing them is just as well given it allows DM to use it no matter the starting date of their campaign. True, but the fact that certain cities are shown as "ruins" means the map displays a relatively recent Flanaess (probably 591 CY, if not later), so frontiers wouldn't have hurt.
I also wish they had shown major roads, something which has always been missing in large-scale maps of GH
Ah well, can't have everything I suppose...
I wouldn't want the map over-cluttered with information. There probably wouldn't be well defined boundaries beyond geographical features such as rivers and mountains. I'm just glad that there are hexes on the map.
I'll be working up the place names for map #3 and when I've finished all 4 maps I can start figuring out which places have not been included.
I also wish they had shown major roads, something which has always been missing in large-scale maps of GH
Ah well, can't have everything I suppose...
I found a map somewhere in my endless GH wanderings called "flanroads.gif" It doesn't Google, but if someone knows where it can be found, it's awfully handy.
Telas
I wouldn't want the map over-cluttered with information. There probably wouldn't be well defined boundaries beyond geographical features such as rivers and mountains. I'm just glad that there are hexes on the map.
For once Jason, I disagree with you.
I hardly think little red dots (for borders) and thin brown lines (for major roads) would have cluttered a map that still has huge tracks of "virgin" lands depicted. It's not as if they have put every town of every kingdom, so there is a lot of space left.
I was very happy when the work from Carl Sargent was released back in 2E because someone had finally gone to the trouble of putting clear regional borders on the maps (no, not the big maps from the boxed set but those from, say, the Adventure Begins), something which had always been missing.
The only way to visualize borders back in 1E was to look at the AL and Wealth division of the Flanaess and then, somehow, transpose that to the big maps from the WoG boxed set.
Roads would have been fine, but a little knowledge about GH history and human nature will allow you to place them where they should go.
Finally, I'm very appreciative that WotC/TSR/whoever has never seen fit to detail every square inch of GH. I like the elbow room.
Telas
It's easy to "redesignate" a border, but not so easy to shift a road three miles one way or the other. ;)
Most of the civilized lands should be laced with villages, hamlets, manors, farms, etc... linked by side-roads, trails and paths. Even major roads wouldn't be much more than wide beaten dirt paths, perhaps graveled in some areas, but nothing like what we know of as roads.
Even major roads wouldn't be much more than wide beaten dirt paths, perhaps graveled in some areas, but nothing like what we know of as roads.
:D Hey, some of us would know them.
Most of the civilized lands should be laced with villages, hamlets, manors, farms, etc... linked by side-roads, trails and paths. Even major roads wouldn't be much more than wide beaten dirt paths, perhaps graveled in some areas, but nothing like what we know of as roads.
I definitely envision the Aerdy dirawaen as similar to Roman roads, meaning that they would be worth of inclusion on the poster maps. That said, it doesn't bother me that they're not there, since I can draw my own roads without any worries about official canon now :D
For some good resources on Roman roads, which were architectural marvels, see http://www.unrv.com/culture/roman-roads.php and http://www.unrv.com/culture/roman-road-construction.php and http://www.unrv.com/culture/roman-road-chart.php
IMC, Dwarven roads are Roman roads; all others are of lesser quality.
Although some other roads are very well built, only the Dwarves have the patience and stoneworking skills necessary to build a road that will last for millenia. Some of the richest kingdoms will hire bands of Dwarves to build roads for them, at least until they realize the costs and contruction times involved.
A road that will last for thousands of years may be nice, but very few rulers are willing to let its construction possibly outlive their children.
Telas
IMC, Dwarven roads are Roman roads; all others are of lesser quality.
Although some other roads are very well built, only the Dwarves have the patience and stoneworking skills necessary to build a road that will last for millenia.
So, if I follow you...
Dwarves built the Roman roads?
So, if I follow you...
Dwarves built the Roman roads?
If you've ever driven in Rome, you'd already know that it couldn't have been the Romans....
Telas.
Where is this location detailed? It was not in LGG map and it's not something made by Bone March triad because their only location that side of the river is a small village of Nlul.
It's name did not pop up in Ivid the Undying either....
Cheers.
S.H, Ahlissa (Naerie) webslave
Any other errors or ommisions on the maps? I haven't really looked closely at mine yet.
Beetu is described in The Marklands, and is a city of Nyrond (pop 11,000) located near the Celedon Forest and the Gnatmarsh... its placement near Knurl on the poster map would seem to be an error.
By about thousand miles it seems :D
S.H, Ahlissa (Naerie) webslave
In 'Ivid' Sargent describes the primary roads in the Great Kingdom as magicked so that they restore themselves in some fashion.
That is exactly the kind of thing I would expect from the Great Kingdom. A misuse of an incredible magical ability that is all at once showy, silly, and vain, and is not near worth the benefit that it brings. Just like Mussolini's edict that aides must sprint into his office so as to cause minimal interruption, it's less about effectiveness than it is about the conspicuous exercise of power.
Sure, self-healing roads are nice, but can you imagine the magical research that went into it, and the cost of the components and (I guess) XP? Wow.
Telas
First, there was a time when the Great Kindgom was filthy rich. Heck, it was the center of civilization in the Flanaess!
Second, roads are what allowed Romans to rule their empire for so long. Without sturdy roads, you've got not easy way to take troops rapidly from point A to point B, and when you rule a large empire, that's a prerequisite...
A notable special case are the magical roads, the dirawaen in Old Oeridian, crafted by combat mages using earth elementals they otherwise commanded in battle. With special weather-resistant magics woven into their crafting, these roads made travel and provisioning much easier for the Oeridian invaders.
Paraphase:
It also suggests these roads allowed the early Oeridians the edge to deal with the northern flan and the southern suel by shifting its armies as needed.
btw map errors,
Where is the cauldron of night (Tar Hill)...Asperdi Isle (Sea Barons) Ivid the Undying but it is missing on the new map.
I found a map somewhere in my endless GH wanderings called "flanroads.gif" It doesn't Google, but if someone knows where it can be found, it's awfully handy.
Telas
Whoo hoo, that would be my creation...derivative of course from the various CY 585 sourcebooks.
You can find that map here: http://members.aol.com/bobhrad/files.htm
Halber
Thanks again for a handy aid.
Telas
I went googling for the map after Telas mentioned it, but couldn't find it.Hey guys. Do any of you know where I can find a good map of Greyhawk other then the Dungons magazine and the LGG?
the 83 boxed set...
Whoo hoo, that would be my creation...derivative of course from the various CY 585 sourcebooks.
You can find that map here: http://members.aol.com/bobhrad/files.htm
Halber
Halber, are you Bob Hrad?? If so I had no idea, and thanks for your site, it's been quite useful over the years :D
Halber, are you Bob Hrad?? If so I had no idea, and thanks for your site, it's been quite useful over the years :D
Uh, yeah, that's me, Robert Hradek. Thanks, I feel honored and could say the same to you about your works many times over.
Halber
the 83 boxed set...
Yup. Darlene's map is the Bible to me. My Gygaxian Greyhawk Bible. My Gryble.
All other maps are mere shadows compared to it.
These latest Dungeon maps are great, but I'm finding too many discrepancies for it to become my new Gryble. It's purty, though. Darn purty.
Similarly, the southern edge of the Adri seems to have suddenly acquired some hills that weren't mentioned elsewhere, as has the gap between the Iron Hills and the Hollow Highlands leading into northern Naerie/Idee, which appears to have vanished.
Still a gorgeous map though...
P.
...negative letters (if such a concept exists).
Sure they do. I received the high school grades to prove it. ;)
English: D-
French: D-
Math: C-
Physics: C-
Chemistry: D-
Computer Science: A-
Phys Ed: D-
Biology: C-
All in all, we now have the best fantasy map in the industry - yet another reason to congratulate Paizo.
I don't think they're the best in the industry, but that's only because I still use the previous maps. I think anyone who takes these as their canon will be able to say the opposite, though, and properly so--they're very pretty maps. And as long as a fair proportion of people can say that, they're a good set of maps.
Unfortunately, the location indicators have changed. Presumably this is because the map covers a larger area than the Darlene maps and using identical location indicators would necessitate the use of negative numbers and negative letters (if such a concept exists). All in all, we now have the best fantasy map in the industry - yet another reason to congratulate Paizo.
That's a very good point. Is there a list out there somewhere of the hex coordinates? I'll work them out if not, but am I reading the map correctly?
For example is Admundfort at K3-94?
The LGG map, due to its tiny size, is pretty whacked insofar as distances between places are concerned.
I didn't notice that the Pomarj coastline had shifted until this post. Sure enough, Rob took a little bite out of the southeastern coast. Of course someone set their campaign there. Sorry!
As for Suderham. . . well, I confess that I left it out of the map for two reasons. One, it's secret (an unevenly applied metric, to be sure), and secondly, the place is called "Mt. Flamenbut," which is fantastically lame. Its location appears in the "Slavers!" adventure, for the over-curious.
There's an unfortunate error on the NE quadrant, which is the one that will arrive with 121. Somehow, the village of "Middle Nordran" turned into another "High Nordran," which is listed immediately next to it in North Kingdom.
Personally, I blame one of Xaene's heads.
--Erik Mona
BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!
Incidentally, I thought that Cauldron and Sasserine just "popping" into existence was a nice touch. Given the quality of the Campaign Path, it's a welcome addition the campaign setting.
P.
I still wanna know where the Belching Vortex of Leuk-O is (Kambranex's Machinations, Dungeon 91). The adventure said it was in Greyhawk but it never said where. Leuk-O was Oeridian so I'm thinking somewhere in the former GK?
Woesinger is correct. One might add that the Vortex 'opens' in the mountain once known as 'Vashal-Tul' to local dwarves (long-since gone).
However, one shouldn't be led to believe that the Vortex was created by Leuk-O. The late general only discovered it and managed to come out again with his fabled 'servant'.
On a side note, the Vortex would be the ideal place if one wished to introduce Eberron's warforged into GH (and no, I am not actually suggesting doing it; t'is just a wild idea)