Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 sokar Feb 13, 2005 17:18:55	Alright, don't call me stupid for asking this question, but one of my players wants to know. I would think warmages would, since it is basically primal sorcerery that they weild. I also believe that Wu Jen could, as the cast spells in the exact same manner as wizards. Any thoughts? On a side note, where are the dragon isles in relation to Ansalon? (North, south, east west kinda thing)
#2 zombiegleemax Feb 13, 2005 17:31:24	the Dragon Isles are located south of Ansalon...so far south that they may even be on the "other side of the world".
#3 sokar Feb 13, 2005 17:39:20	the Dragon Isles are located south of Ansalon...so far south that they may even be on the "other side of the world". Ah, thank you. Now, in regards to my other question...
#4 Dragonhelm Feb 13, 2005 18:04:28	Alright, don't call me stupid for asking this question, but one of my players wants to know. I would think warmages would, since it is basically primal sorcerery that they weild. I also believe that Wu Jen could, as the cast spells in the exact same manner as wizards. Any thoughts? Warmages would definitely use wild sorcery and be available after the Chaos War. The wu jen would essentially be an "elementalist", or a wizard with some odd and strange customs. Perhaps wu jen come from distant lands. I could see them used for the Tarmak. Basically, just ignore the Oriental flavoring and you're good. Warlocks are more difficult, but not impossible. I would say they also tap into wild sorcery, but in a very different sort of way. Their abilities are more along the line of spell-like abilities, right? Since spell-like abilities typically come from wild sorcery, that seems like a decent fit. Out of all of these classes, this would probably be the one I wouldn't use in DL, unless the player had a really good background story.
#5 talinthas Feb 13, 2005 18:23:49	um. given that ansalon is attached to the south pole of krynn, you can't go any farther south. The dragon isles are equitorial, and thus, north of Ansalon.
#6 sokar Feb 13, 2005 19:04:25	Thanks to everyone who replied. Your help made our game that much better.
#7 cam_banks Feb 13, 2005 20:58:00	I'm more inclined to use the warlock than the sorcerer sometimes when it comes to ambient magic-users. Just something to throw in there. Cheers, Cam
#8 Dragonhelm Feb 13, 2005 21:11:27	I'm more inclined to use the warlock than the sorcerer sometimes when it comes to ambient magic-users. Just something to throw in there. Why's that, Cam?
#9 cam_banks Feb 13, 2005 21:30:59	Why's that, Cam? Especially when it comes to innate spellcasters. I have a strong sense that the kind of magic used in the early Age of Mortals was very much in the same vein as how the warlock picks up invocations. Specific effects which he tailors later on to do various things. 5th age sorcerers and mystics have a narrow field of familiarity but in that field they're able to do a lot more with it. Linsha's a mystic, for example, and all of her training is in mentalism and healing, but very little else. I think the warlock serves as an example of how WOTC would have done the sorcerer in the first place had they felt they could sort out the finer points of it. It's very clearly not a wizard that casts his spells spontaneously - it's a character with the power to draw on ambient magic for specific effects that he has mastered. I would, of course, ditch the bloodline aspects entirely. Cheers, Cam
#10 cam_banks Feb 13, 2005 21:32:49	One recent example in my own campaign - I've used the warlock for ogre titans, had my players encounter a titan in the Peak of Malys only this afternoon. Very tough opponent. Blasts of arcane power, various utility effects, nothing more than that - but true to the original titan concept. Cheers, Cam
#11 true_blue Feb 13, 2005 22:38:00	I sometimes dislike new spellcasting base classes mainly because of their spell lists. There's nothing wrong initially with their spell lists and their powers. Most of them are very good classes that my players and I both like. But we're so used to being able to pour through book after book looking at spells and such. And most of these classes just have such a small selection. Their initial spells basically never change. I wish that more classes would be looked at whenever spells come out. As an example, in the Players Guide to faerun and other books they have new Blackguard, Assassin, etc spells. I like to see this because it expands the possibilities. Now some classes may be made specifically to have a limited selection to spells, and that is fine. But something like the warmage mainly has access to a lot of evocation spells. But in new books that come out, none of the spells will say they are also warmage spells. Now i know most people would say if its a sorc/wizard spell of X level, than its a warmage spell of X level. But I dont think thats exactly possible with every class that is made. There are certain spells given to certain classes at different levels because of maybe balance issues, flavor, etc. I just think its a little bit of work to go through for each class, through each spell and figure out whats right. Other people may see this as not a problem and like the limited spell selection. And others may like the thrill of going through and adjusting new spells to fit on the spell lists. For me, its just a lot of work. I just wish future products would expand on material that was made before them. Even a small little index would be nice.
#12 zombiegleemax Feb 13, 2005 23:13:13	I sometimes dislike new spellcasting base classes mainly because of their spell lists. There's nothing wrong initially with their spell lists and their powers. Most of them are very good classes that my players and I both like. But we're so used to being able to pour through book after book looking at spells and such. And most of these classes just have such a small selection. Their initial spells basically never change. I wish that more classes would be looked at whenever spells come out. As an example, in the Players Guide to faerun and other books they have new Blackguard, Assassin, etc spells. I like to see this because it expands the possibilities. Now some classes may be made specifically to have a limited selection to spells, and that is fine. But something like the warmage mainly has access to a lot of evocation spells. But in new books that come out, none of the spells will say they are also warmage spells. Now i know most people would say if its a sorc/wizard spell of X level, than its a warmage spell of X level. But I dont think thats exactly possible with every class that is made. There are certain spells given to certain classes at different levels because of maybe balance issues, flavor, etc. I just think its a little bit of work to go through for each class, through each spell and figure out whats right. Other people may see this as not a problem and like the limited spell selection. And others may like the thrill of going through and adjusting new spells to fit on the spell lists. For me, its just a lot of work. I just wish future products would expand on material that was made before them. Even a small little index would be nice. There is a small little index in Complete Arcane, page 94, that has a list of spells in Complete Arcane that are usable for the Hexblade(Complete Warrior).
#13 kalanth Feb 14, 2005 0:27:38	For me, personally, I try to limit the DL world to only what is in the core books and the Campaign books. I don't allow a majority of the PrCs in the splat books or anything. This is a complete opposite of my homebrew were if it exsists, it is useable. DL has always felt so pure and untainted to me. No psionics (I felt betrayed by this in the War of the Soul, but thats a different story), a clear cut magic system, Knights instead of Paladins, and so on. I was peterbed by the Solamnics becoming PrC's (along with the nerakan knights) but I can understand why they would do it. So to go tossing more spellcasting classes into the ring would be to much. Especially (in my mind) the Wu Jen. There is not much of an asian flair to DL, and so I would never allow an asian class into a DL campaign (maybe I should read the revised Wu Jen first, but this opinion is based on the original in the Oriental Adventures book). I would say that these classes don't fit to well at all. Maybe to warmage, but that would really be it. Unless, of course, you went with the ideal that the class came from an unknown traveler that managed to cross the seas and venture to Ansalon from Taladas. Then there would be just cause for the class to exsist.
#14 zombiegleemax Feb 14, 2005 10:47:54	the Dragon Isles are located south of Ansalon...so far south that they may even be on the "other side of the world". Not so: they are to the north of Ansalon. If they were to the south, they would be in the middle of the southern icecap.
#15 Dragonhelm Feb 14, 2005 11:53:39	DL has always felt so pure and untainted to me. No psionics (I felt betrayed by this in the War of the Soul, but thats a different story), There were no psionics used in War of Souls. It sounds like you're referring to Targonne, who used the magic of mentalism, one of the spheres of mysticism. Especially (in my mind) the Wu Jen. There is not much of an asian flair to DL, and so I would never allow an asian class into a DL campaign (maybe I should read the revised Wu Jen first, but this opinion is based on the original in the Oriental Adventures book). Without the flavor text, the wu jen basically amounts to an elemental-based wizard. I would say that these classes don't fit to well at all. Maybe to warmage, but that would really be it. Unless, of course, you went with the ideal that the class came from an unknown traveler that managed to cross the seas and venture to Ansalon from Taladas. Then there would be just cause for the class to exsist. DLA was set up in such a way as to incorporate characters "from the beyond". In essence, it was set up to where you could import your characters from other worlds into Krynn. That could also be used for cases such as the warlock.
#16 daedavias_dup Feb 14, 2005 12:16:05	I wrote an article a while back that is on the Nexus about fitting Complete Arcane to Dragonlance. I kept the fey and fiendish bloodline idea, saying that the presence of non-Creation race blood allowed Creation race members to access Wild Sorcery. My personal opinion would be that they could even access the magic before the Fifth Age. I would like to say the magic is untainted, but that isn't easy to pull off.
#17 zombiegleemax Feb 17, 2005 23:35:15	I can see each of the classes... Warlock - With evil Gods taking an active role in daily life, I can see a warlock being created. Wu Jen - Take away ther asian flavor and you end up with an odd type of wizard. Warmage - Basically an evocation expert... I'd probably only allow the Warlock, but I'd say any of them could fit with small changes.
#18 ferratus Feb 24, 2005 14:18:16	Since we're stuck with the sorcerer for ambient magic, I don't really see why the Warlock can't be incorporated into Dragonlance. We know that Dragonlance has various demons and demon princes that serve the gods. We also have the "Brown Hoods" of Vedevisca (sp?) and that priest in the barbarians trilogy that absorbed all that spirtual power from the standing stones. There is also the elf in the "Qualinesti" trilogy that made a pact with Hiddukel for a 1000 years of service for 1000 years of power. So the standard explanation that warlocks get their power from pacts with extra-planar powers certainly works for dragonlance. An extreme form of imbue with spell ability. Of course, they would be among the most hunted renegades.