Where are these two immortals worshipped and by whom?
I know Hugin has created a cleric spell list for Terra and perhaps also Djaea, but what about druids?
Should their powers or spell lists be altered to reflect the immortal's designs?
What are the agendas or codex for followers of Terra and Djaea? What are they concerned about?
I am trying to understand how they relate to life/death/rebirth, good vs. evil struggle, chaos vs. law struggle, "nature" vs. "civilization" etc.
Any help will be mighty appreciated!!
Cheers,
:-) Jesper
Well, WotI said that Djaea's clerics were able to cast 1st and 2nd level druidic spells as well. I elaborated on that and basically say that they cannot only cast 1st and 2nd level druidic spells, but ALL clerics of Djaea are in fact DRUIDS. So there's no difference between a Druid and a cleric of Djaea in Mystara: they both use the druid's spell list.
However, there might be other druids who do not worship "NaturE" as a spirit or a philosophy, but specific NEUTRAL immortals such as Ordana, Zirchev, Ilsundal, Protius and Mahmatti Running Elk who are considered true protectors of nature. IN THAT case we may have clerics or druids of a specific immortal.
Note that Terra is strictly LG, so there shouldn't be Druids worshipping Terra IMO (since she's not Neutral)... but I'm open to other ideas
I haven't examined my spell lists in light of this but I hope to very soon (I also want to change Odin's special clerical powers to that Raven familar you suggested a long time ago ;) )
What are the agendas or codex for followers of Terra and Djaea? What are they concerned about?
I am trying to understand how they relate to life/death/rebirth, good vs. evil struggle, chaos vs. law struggle, "nature" vs. "civilization" etc.
Djaea and Terra share some basic portfolio as nature- and earth-oriented Immortals, but:
- Terra is older, and more elemental, than Djaea, who is a younger Immortal (dates back to GRoF)
- Terra has an interest in new species, Djaea is more focused on protection and survival
- Terra has a large following in Brun (goblinoids, several non-humans of the Savage Coast, Ethengar as Yamuga), Djaea's following is based outside Brun (I'd say Davania, mostly)
- Terra's followers are mostly goblinoids and other non-humans, Djaea's followers are more likely to be humans (she was a neathar herself)
- Terra is LN, while Djaea is NB (according to Warriors of Heaven)
:-) Jesper
Thanks for the replies guys, but I am confused now: how can Terra be LG (according to the DM quote in Hugin's reply) and still have mainly humanoid followers and priests?
Most of the facts about Terra we are reporting come from AD&D sources: Terra appears as the patron of many humanoids and goblinoids in Savage Coast (q.v.).
Her priests must be LG or LN, and her followers may be of any non-C alignment.
In AD&D, most goblinoids are LE, but in Mystara races are rarely good or evil by definition (even chromatic dragons are not necessarily evil). Specifically, Savage Coast goblinoids are savage, but not particularly evil -- not any more than the Ethengars (they follow similar Immortals, Ixion and Terra, with very similar names, Tubak/Tabak and Yamuga/Yamag, as well as similar portfolios).
Other followers of Terra are the phanatons, omm-wa, and caymas (all of these are generally friendly, though technologically non very advanced).
Note that most of these cultures also have other patrons, so e.g. chaotic caymas would worship Kurtulmak rather than Terra (or could be pantheistic shamans).
BTW, the only official source I'm aware of regarding Terra's alignment (with the good-evil axis) is Warriors of Heaven, which gives LN rather than LG (she's considered a power of Arcadia, a borderline LN-LG plane).
I suppose most of the savage priests of Terra would be LN (very appropriate, IMO). They would most likely use the Shaman kit presented in the SC books.
I'm not entirely sure I'd allow druid worshippers of Terra -- she doesn't seem a druidic power. Shamans seem more appropriate to me.
Djaea OTOH is clearly Neutral and only interested in preserving the balance inside each ecosystem, survival of living races and of planets. She's the Mother Nature kind of goddess, Terra is OTOH Mother Earth, they shouldn't be confused. Terra is not interested in say seas or forests, only in preserving earth's fertility. Djaea's interests are broader in this field, she encompasses all nature's aspects. That's why most druids worship her even though they do not automatically KNOW of her existence or her true identity (rather they worship the "force of nature", but she grants them their spells).
I believe Djaea has followers all around the world, she's not confined to a specific continent, that also explains her high status in the immortal hierarchy. I also believe that before Djaea there were NO druids on Mystara. It is likely she invented druidism after her ascension.
I remind you to my description of Djaea in the Complete Immortals' List thread. IIRC I did also Terra's background there.
The problem I have with Terra (and Ixion) is that she's been associated to Yamuga and Yamag, a goddess of NEUTRALITY according to GAZ12 (while Tubak/Tabak is a god of LAW), whereas she's completely LAWFUL (and Ixion is certainly NEUTRAL GOOD)... I am still tempted to disregard this information Allston gave us in WotI and rewrite the entries for Tubak, Yamuga and Cretia as three spirits (from Spirit World of GAZ12) who became immortals, as GAZ12 stated. IMO the problem is more on the figure of Terra (from LG to N) than on Ixion (who as NG can be interpreted as LG or CG too by his followers, as the Sindhi do).
The problem I have with Terra (and Ixion) is that she's been associated to Yamuga and Yamag, a goddess of NEUTRALITY according to GAZ12 (while Tubak/Tabak is a god of LAW), whereas she's completely LAWFUL (and Ixion is certainly NEUTRAL GOOD)... I am still tempted to disregard this information Allston gave us in WotI and rewrite the entries for Tubak, Yamuga and Cretia as three spirits (from Spirit World of GAZ12) who became immortals, as GAZ12 stated. IMO the problem is more on the figure of Terra (from LG to N) than on Ixion (who as NG can be interpreted as LG or CG too by his followers, as the Sindhi do).
I don't think this is really so difficult. Yamag is a Lawful figure in SC, so the reinterpretation of Terra as Neutral is limited to Ethengar, and could be considered as an interpretation given by the Ethengars.
In any case, I prefer to keep the Terra = Yamuga version, since otherwise Terra would be left without followers, which is not that good for such an important Immortal.
The idea of closely associating Djaea and druidism is quite interesting, considering the following points:
- Djaea was a Neathar, and druidism is typical of a Neathar culture (the Robrenn)
- In AD&D Mystara, OD&D Druids are translated as Balancers, and ``true'' Druids are said to come from ``south and west'', which can be taken as SC and Davania, where M-Celts live (the Hinterlanders, the Robrenn)
That said, K:KoA says that:
- Balancers are worshippers of nature Immortals
- Druids are basically philosophers, though they may worship Immortals
- Mystaran Druids can be LN, TN or CN
Therefore, there can be LN Balancer or Druid followers of Terra (K:KoA esplicitly refers to Terra as a potential patron of druids).
I remind you to my description of Djaea in the Complete Immortals' List thread. IIRC I did also Terra's background there.
Hmm... tried doing a search in that thread but didn't find it. Have to look again. Thanks DM!
:-) Jesper
Hmm... tried doing a search in that thread but didn't find it. Have to look again. Thanks DM!
I checked each page of that thread to find Terra as well and it isn't there. I also checked my "Marco's Immortals" folder to see if I had copied it there, but no luck!
I guess I'll have to add Terra to the list of immortals to upload very soon, then ;)
whoops, my bad!
I guess I'll have to add Terra to the list of immortals to upload very soon, then ;)
Any hope of seeing this today or tomorrow? (I'll be playing again on Sunday :D )
Jesper