I know the footman lance was like a normal lance.
Would a mounted Dragonlance be considered a Large weapon accurding to 3.5 rules?
No, it like any other weapon is sized for the wielder, but it is awkward to use when not mounted.
Cheers,
Cam
Would a mounted Dragonlance be considered a Large weapon accurding to 3.5 rules?
I know the footman lance was like a normal lance.
Under the 3.5e rules, it would be considered a "two-handed weapon." I am unsure that it would be classified an "exotic weapon" since it would require some kind of support attached to the saddle, but I'm leaning toward "martial," since the Solamnic Knights were able to wield them with near ease during the War of the Lance.
Lances are meant to be used while mounted. In an old movie called "Excalibur" u can see lances in action better than in any recent movie, and IMHO they are are not suited for unmounted combat and they CAN´T be thrown.
But, since this a game and historycal facts are irrelevant, u can do this:
The Dragonlance (no matter what DLCS says) IS A LONGSPEAR, when mounted u attach it to a special saddle with a shield like form and a pivot for the lance/spear, also is treated as a lance for damage rules purpose.
Hi, i was thinking about the post that i made some time ago about the stats of the mounted dragonlances in the WotL book, the two handed thing, damage, penalty of using one handed and whole thing, i was reading the legend of huma an idea came to my mind.
Yes, they are one handed, well, they are mounted in the saddle and they use it one handed in the novels, but thats not all, i came to think that the dragonlances are other kind of weapon, they are like the "Harpoons" in the matter of rules, i do not try to say that they are "Dragonharpoons", but in the novels the dragonlances are more designed to attach in the dragon when they hit, the core rule lances are not, with the harpoons when you hit the enemy must make a reflex save DC 10+damage dealt or become attached to the weapon and if they try take out the harpoon they must spend a fullround action , and take again the initial damage, very likely to the encounters with dragonlances in the novels to me.
And always when the dragonlances come to escene, the users must take some training to use them, the harpoons are exotic weapons, the lances are not, i dont like the idea of having a dragonlance that is a exotic weapon but they are very differents and they have especific traits to me.
The harpoon stats are in the frostburn book from WotC, its a ranged weapon, but the attach attack make me think about it, im thinking in doing some changes to the dragonlances in my game, take a look:
Exotic Weapon
One handed weapon*
Mounted Dragonlance
Dmg (M) 2d6 critical 20/x3
Reach 10fts
The mounted dragonlances designed to be the bane of dragons are made to attach to the target when they land a critical hit forcing the target to make a reflex save of 10+ damage dealt to escape from the attach attack, if the saving throw fails the enemy cant move away from the reach of the dragonlance until he makes a strenght check DC 23 to break the bonds to the saddle and even then in order to remove the dragonlance from the wound he requires a fullround action if he has two hands free that provokes AoO (or one in the case of a large creature or someone who has the ability to use Large weapons one handed) but it deals damage to himself equal to the initial damage the dragonlance dealt, he can remove the mounted dragonlance without breaking the bonds using the fullround action option too.
The target can try to move along with the mounted dragonlance and the user/mount if he wins an opossed strength check with the mount, if the dragonlance is still bonded to the saddle, or with the attacker if the mounted dragonlance its freed from the bonds of the saddle and the attacker is grabbing the dragonlance.
The attacker/mount can try to move along with the target winning an opossed strength check too, while attached, the mount and the target counts as entangled.
When the weapon its attached the user has three options, continue dealing damage to the target using a standard action to make an attack to the target ignoring the bonus of natural armor and armor bonus of the target, or try to remove the dragonlance taking a fullround action that causes AoO and making a concentration check DC 20 while the target its alive or dc 15 if hes dead to do it and deal damage equal to the initial damage, or release the dragonlance from the saddle taking a fullround action that provokes AoO and making a concentration check DC 10.
While the dragonlance is attached and you are manipulating it you dont count as armed unless you have another weapon at hand, incurring the penalties of using a weapon in the offhand, for the dragonlance or the other weapon, you cant fight with both weapons because using the dragonlance while attached requires a standard action.
*The dragonlances are exotic weapons but they are very likely to the normal lances, when you use them without the exotic weapon feat you take only a -2 penalty to attack rolls but when used on foot you take a penalty of -6 to attack rolls and you must use them two handed, its impossible to use the mounted dragonlance two handed and gain the benefits of this while mounted if its bonded to the saddle, and its impossible to use the mounted dragonlance with one hand without the saddle bonds.
The mounted dragonlances deal double damage when used from the back of a charging mount.
This is just the bare weapon stats, the magic and the materials comes later.
With the infantry dragonlances I’ll use the normal Lance of the PHB, and for the mounted dragonlances of the WotL book I will use the same as the mounted dragonlance with a circumstance bonus to AC and reflex saves while mounted but with full penalty to attacks if not used with the exotic weapon feat, and by the way, from the old post, you don’t incur a penalty to attacks if using a Lance with one hand while mounted p.118.
And for the huma dragonlance i will make one of the mounted dragonlances just bigger, and im thinking about changing the attach attack "all the time" maybe it will work only in critical hits.
about the 2 handed thing, the PHB especifies that you can use the Lance one handed while mounted.
Edit: Attach only in a critical hit.
3.5e rules uses six categories: simple, martial, exotic, light, one-handed, and two-handed.
Size of weapon is only used to determine if there is a size penalty and base weapon damage. A Small lance (dmg 1d6, crit x3, reach) would work in the hand of a gnome fighter, but in the hand of an elf fighter (Medium) would suffer -2 size penalty to their attack rolls. A Medium lance (dmg 1d8, crit x3, reach) would do the opposite.
I know rules are very flexible when it comes to create new stuff, but small dragonlances reduces an icon into a ridiculous thing. Elves and humans are known to use these weapons, take cultural backgrounds in mind. Gnomes would rather use a mechanical lance perhaps, and honestly a kender trying to wiled a standard size lance to protect his friends is more dragonlance like flavor than using a small lance.
By the way, the harpoon adaptation sounds great
Maybe i'm sort of narrow minded for saying but... DON'T USE SMALL DRAGOLANCES!!!!
Well, in a perfectly logical fantasy world, Kender would never be Solamnic Knights.
But Krynn is nowhere near perfect.
By the way, the harpoon adaptation sounds great
Thanks, i will leave the attach thing only when it lands a critical hit, but with the fact that my players are playing with evil characters, i dont thing that they will have a dragonlance in the near future, or any use for an abyssal lance without good dragons
one thing though
say the lance is mounted into the saddle mount and your flying a dragon yourself and you hit another dragon in a air attack and it attaches, i forsee all 3 (or 4 if other dragon has a rider) falling to their respective dooms from the sky