My alternate rules for MotRD - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

My alternate rules for MotRD

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
Prof._Pacali
Jun 26, 2005 9:50:09 Hi there! This is Prof. Pacali, back after lurking for a while. I recently bought the Masque of the Red Death 3.5 book, and I wasn't too thrilled with some of the rules. So I made up a few alternate rules, which I also posted on the Fraternity of Shadows boards, under the guise of the Kosher Pickled Punk. Here are the alternate rules I came up with.

I'd like to first say that I know that the authors endeavored to convert MotRD to 3.5 as best as possible, and in many ways their work shows in the book. However I disagree with some of the choices they made about certain rules, and other rules make no sense. So I decided to try and make a set of alternate rules, which are presented below.

1) Arcane spellcasters do get bonus spells for a high ability score, INT for Adepts, Metaphysicians and Occultists, and CHA for Charlatans. I see no reason why they shouldn't get these bonus spells, other than the fact that they didn't have them in 2E. Considering that spells take longer to cast, and that their is a chance of failing a DP check, I imagine most PCs will not cast as many spells, but for those Adepts who will, give them bonus spells.

2) The book never says how many languages a PC starts with. In a typical D&D campaign it depends on race, so I decided to base it on nationality. You start speaking your nationality's language(s) plus a number of bonus languages equal to your INT bonus. For example an American with an INT of 14 would start with English, plus two other modern languages. A character from Switzerland, might start with German, French, or Italian, or with the DM's approval could speak any two of the languages. In areas colonized by the Great Powers, such as India, a native PC begins with his native language and the language of the country which colonized the area, plus bonus languages.

3) The Shootist is now called the Marksman. (The title applies to either gender.)

4) The Occultist should gain bonus spells for specializing in a school of magic. He also chooses two (not one) opposing schools, neither of which may be divination (see the PHB p. 57 for details).

5) Parsons may select any religion (not just an ancient one) for the Bonus Skill Focus feat at 3rd level. Parsons are not prohibited from taking combat oriented feats, unless their religion specifically forbids them to.

6) Mystics, mediums and spiritualists should all be able to turn/rebuke undead (depending on alignment). See PHB p. 159. All undead in Gothic Earth get +1 Turn Resistance, as they would in Ravenloft.

7) Criminals (and any Prestige Class with the Trapfinding Special Quality) do get to use Search and Disable Device to find and disable magical traps. However the DC to do so is increased by +20.

8 ) Tradesmen: the ability "Related Profession or Craft" makes no sense as written. Instead, Tradesmen gain a Bonus Class Skill at 3rd, 9th and 15th levels. This bonus class skill is considered a class skill in all regards. It reflects areas of expertise the Tradesman has gained through her life experiences.

9) The Performer gets Sleight of Hand as a class skill.

10) Lycanthrope Hunter: the "Special" qualification for this PrC is incredibly vague. For the encounter to qualify, the PC must know the NPC is a lycanthrope, and fought it (but not necessarily defeated it).

11) Undead Hunter: the "Special" qualification for this PrC is incredibly vague. For the encounter to qualify, the PC must know the NPC is undead, and fought it (but not necessarily defeated it). The "Favored Enemy" Special Quality functions exactly as written under the Ranger class in the PHB. This Special Quality does not give the PC knowledge of undead; that knowledge comes from the Knowledge (Forbidden Lore) skill. The PC must still make skill checks to see if he recognizes weaknesses of undead.

12) Academician should be replaced with the Search skill when searching libraries for information.

13) The Connoisseur skill should be a feat, which grants a +2 bonus to Appraise and one Craft skill.

14) The Self-sufficient skill should provide a +2 bonus on First Aid and Survival checks, not Heal and Survivial.

15) Find Familiar feat: no mention is made of the costs involved in using this feat. Each time a familiar is summoned, the PC must spend $50 worth of materials. The familair summoned is a dread familiar; there is no DP check.

16) Bows should not be considered Simple weapons. They should be either Primitive or Exotic Weapons. Crossbows should be simple weapons, except the hand crossbow, which should be Exotic.

17) An Adept who fails to successfully copy a spell into her spellbook, but has successfully classified the spell, may not attempt to copy the spell until they gain a rank in Knowledge (Forbidden Lore).

Any comments?
#2
zombiegleemax
Jul 12, 2005 2:45:29 I also was disappointed with the revised MotRD, especially against the free version used by the living death campaign. There just wasn't enough new material to make me feel good about the purchase. That said if you haven't seen the LD version of the rules then its a good adaptation to 3.X rules.

I agree with more of your points than not, but have some differences of opinion. If I haven't mentioned something I agree with your post.

(1 & 4) I am against bonus spells. Magic not only is harder to work in MotRD, the traditions teaching it are more fragmented (that is to say inferior) to a traditional fantasy world. The reduction of number of spells is appropriate under these conditions. In the alternative I believe you could offer one less spell per level that the tables would normally grant but allow bonus for high attribute and/or specialization. I'm not sure it makes much difefernce though, as you've said its a pretty rare caster that gets through his or her collection of memorized spells each day even at fairly low levels.

(7) Similiar to one and four I don't believe an average criminal (safecracker/cat burgler) should have the ability to deal with magical traps. The knowledge and traditions just aren't there. Maybe a feat could be made available to criminals who are exposed to magic and/or have levels in a spellcasting class. In this case I'd let them handle a magical trap just like the core rules.

(10 & 11) I guess I like the special requirement more than you do. I believe the prospective PC should defeat not merely fight such a creature (undead or lycanthrope) in a small unit "skirmish" (that is to say an adventuring party). In bigger numbers how much did you contribute? If you've never killed one (just fought one) you also aren't much of a hunter are you?

(12) I like the Accademician skill. IMO search is much more of a field skill. Finding material through research in records and books is sufficiently different IMO to merrit a seperate skill. I would not expect a gifted lawyer who knows exactly how to sort through old cases and documents to necessarily be a crackerjack crime scene investigator.

(16) Though I agree with you a crossbow is easier to use than a bow the prevelance of archery as a liesure pursuit makes me think that proficiency in bows is easier to come in the Victorian world by for most player characters than training with a crossbow (which would be seriously anachronistic, if not plain weird).

Just my thoughts.

-Eric Gorman
#3
Prof._Pacali
Jul 17, 2005 17:06:20
(1 & 4) I am against bonus spells. Magic not only is harder to work in MotRD, the traditions teaching it are more fragmented (that is to say inferior) to a traditional fantasy world. The reduction of number of spells is appropriate under these conditions. In the alternative I believe you could offer one less spell per level that the tables would normally grant but allow bonus for high attribute and/or specialization. I'm not sure it makes much difefernce though, as you've said its a pretty rare caster that gets through his or her collection of memorized spells each day even at fairly low levels.

The problem I have with the issue of bonus spells, is that it was done in such an arbitrary manner. Arcane spellcasters don't get them, but divine casters do? Why? The only reason I can think of is that it was that way in 2E. Either give them to both, or take them away from both. Otherwise it hurts the arcane casters, without there being much of a reason for it.
#4
zombiegleemax
Jul 21, 2005 1:58:30 Divine casters do in the new book? Hunh. I must have missed that - if I were running a Masque campaign I wouldn't grant them bonus spells for high attributes either. In Living Death no class gains extra spells for high attributes...and in some ways is more forgiving for using magic than the 3X version of MotRD.

-Eric Gorman
#5
Prof._Pacali
Jul 25, 2005 19:06:48 Eric, check out pages 53 (under Intelligence), and 54. It explicitly says that arcane casters don't get bonus spells, but doesn't say one way or the other about divine casters.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 Prof._Pacali Jun 26, 2005 9:50:09	Hi there! This is Prof. Pacali, back after lurking for a while. I recently bought the Masque of the Red Death 3.5 book, and I wasn't too thrilled with some of the rules. So I made up a few alternate rules, which I also posted on the Fraternity of Shadows boards, under the guise of the Kosher Pickled Punk. Here are the alternate rules I came up with. I'd like to first say that I know that the authors endeavored to convert MotRD to 3.5 as best as possible, and in many ways their work shows in the book. However I disagree with some of the choices they made about certain rules, and other rules make no sense. So I decided to try and make a set of alternate rules, which are presented below. 1) Arcane spellcasters do get bonus spells for a high ability score, INT for Adepts, Metaphysicians and Occultists, and CHA for Charlatans. I see no reason why they shouldn't get these bonus spells, other than the fact that they didn't have them in 2E. Considering that spells take longer to cast, and that their is a chance of failing a DP check, I imagine most PCs will not cast as many spells, but for those Adepts who will, give them bonus spells. 2) The book never says how many languages a PC starts with. In a typical D&D campaign it depends on race, so I decided to base it on nationality. You start speaking your nationality's language(s) plus a number of bonus languages equal to your INT bonus. For example an American with an INT of 14 would start with English, plus two other modern languages. A character from Switzerland, might start with German, French, or Italian, or with the DM's approval could speak any two of the languages. In areas colonized by the Great Powers, such as India, a native PC begins with his native language and the language of the country which colonized the area, plus bonus languages. 3) The Shootist is now called the Marksman. (The title applies to either gender.) 4) The Occultist should gain bonus spells for specializing in a school of magic. He also chooses two (not one) opposing schools, neither of which may be divination (see the PHB p. 57 for details). 5) Parsons may select any religion (not just an ancient one) for the Bonus Skill Focus feat at 3rd level. Parsons are not prohibited from taking combat oriented feats, unless their religion specifically forbids them to. 6) Mystics, mediums and spiritualists should all be able to turn/rebuke undead (depending on alignment). See PHB p. 159. All undead in Gothic Earth get +1 Turn Resistance, as they would in Ravenloft. 7) Criminals (and any Prestige Class with the Trapfinding Special Quality) do get to use Search and Disable Device to find and disable magical traps. However the DC to do so is increased by +20. 8 ) Tradesmen: the ability "Related Profession or Craft" makes no sense as written. Instead, Tradesmen gain a Bonus Class Skill at 3rd, 9th and 15th levels. This bonus class skill is considered a class skill in all regards. It reflects areas of expertise the Tradesman has gained through her life experiences. 9) The Performer gets Sleight of Hand as a class skill. 10) Lycanthrope Hunter: the "Special" qualification for this PrC is incredibly vague. For the encounter to qualify, the PC must know the NPC is a lycanthrope, and fought it (but not necessarily defeated it). 11) Undead Hunter: the "Special" qualification for this PrC is incredibly vague. For the encounter to qualify, the PC must know the NPC is undead, and fought it (but not necessarily defeated it). The "Favored Enemy" Special Quality functions exactly as written under the Ranger class in the PHB. This Special Quality does not give the PC knowledge of undead; that knowledge comes from the Knowledge (Forbidden Lore) skill. The PC must still make skill checks to see if he recognizes weaknesses of undead. 12) Academician should be replaced with the Search skill when searching libraries for information. 13) The Connoisseur skill should be a feat, which grants a +2 bonus to Appraise and one Craft skill. 14) The Self-sufficient skill should provide a +2 bonus on First Aid and Survival checks, not Heal and Survivial. 15) Find Familiar feat: no mention is made of the costs involved in using this feat. Each time a familiar is summoned, the PC must spend $50 worth of materials. The familair summoned is a dread familiar; there is no DP check. 16) Bows should not be considered Simple weapons. They should be either Primitive or Exotic Weapons. Crossbows should be simple weapons, except the hand crossbow, which should be Exotic. 17) An Adept who fails to successfully copy a spell into her spellbook, but has successfully classified the spell, may not attempt to copy the spell until they gain a rank in Knowledge (Forbidden Lore). Any comments?
#2 zombiegleemax Jul 12, 2005 2:45:29	I also was disappointed with the revised MotRD, especially against the free version used by the living death campaign. There just wasn't enough new material to make me feel good about the purchase. That said if you haven't seen the LD version of the rules then its a good adaptation to 3.X rules. I agree with more of your points than not, but have some differences of opinion. If I haven't mentioned something I agree with your post. (1 & 4) I am against bonus spells. Magic not only is harder to work in MotRD, the traditions teaching it are more fragmented (that is to say inferior) to a traditional fantasy world. The reduction of number of spells is appropriate under these conditions. In the alternative I believe you could offer one less spell per level that the tables would normally grant but allow bonus for high attribute and/or specialization. I'm not sure it makes much difefernce though, as you've said its a pretty rare caster that gets through his or her collection of memorized spells each day even at fairly low levels. (7) Similiar to one and four I don't believe an average criminal (safecracker/cat burgler) should have the ability to deal with magical traps. The knowledge and traditions just aren't there. Maybe a feat could be made available to criminals who are exposed to magic and/or have levels in a spellcasting class. In this case I'd let them handle a magical trap just like the core rules. (10 & 11) I guess I like the special requirement more than you do. I believe the prospective PC should defeat not merely fight such a creature (undead or lycanthrope) in a small unit "skirmish" (that is to say an adventuring party). In bigger numbers how much did you contribute? If you've never killed one (just fought one) you also aren't much of a hunter are you? (12) I like the Accademician skill. IMO search is much more of a field skill. Finding material through research in records and books is sufficiently different IMO to merrit a seperate skill. I would not expect a gifted lawyer who knows exactly how to sort through old cases and documents to necessarily be a crackerjack crime scene investigator. (16) Though I agree with you a crossbow is easier to use than a bow the prevelance of archery as a liesure pursuit makes me think that proficiency in bows is easier to come in the Victorian world by for most player characters than training with a crossbow (which would be seriously anachronistic, if not plain weird). Just my thoughts. -Eric Gorman
#3 Prof._Pacali Jul 17, 2005 17:06:20	(1 & 4) I am against bonus spells. Magic not only is harder to work in MotRD, the traditions teaching it are more fragmented (that is to say inferior) to a traditional fantasy world. The reduction of number of spells is appropriate under these conditions. In the alternative I believe you could offer one less spell per level that the tables would normally grant but allow bonus for high attribute and/or specialization. I'm not sure it makes much difefernce though, as you've said its a pretty rare caster that gets through his or her collection of memorized spells each day even at fairly low levels. The problem I have with the issue of bonus spells, is that it was done in such an arbitrary manner. Arcane spellcasters don't get them, but divine casters do? Why? The only reason I can think of is that it was that way in 2E. Either give them to both, or take them away from both. Otherwise it hurts the arcane casters, without there being much of a reason for it.
#4 zombiegleemax Jul 21, 2005 1:58:30	Divine casters do in the new book? Hunh. I must have missed that - if I were running a Masque campaign I wouldn't grant them bonus spells for high attributes either. In Living Death no class gains extra spells for high attributes...and in some ways is more forgiving for using magic than the 3X version of MotRD. -Eric Gorman
#5 Prof._Pacali Jul 25, 2005 19:06:48	Eric, check out pages 53 (under Intelligence), and 54. It explicitly says that arcane casters don't get bonus spells, but doesn't say one way or the other about divine casters.